6 years ago
Sugar Vs. Traditional: Should you have your cake or eat it?


We figured it was time we address dating In Real Life (IRL) versus the dating in sugar. What is it that truly makes the lifestyle unique? Is it for everyone? Why or why not? It’s time discuss the difference between these two lifestyle choices, and why people choose to participate in either route.

Traditional Relationship Trials

traditional couple

1. Icebreakers

Whether a person decides to meet their match in person or online, the initial encounter tends to be a bit awkward. Cheesy pick up lines happen and they happen often. More often than not, hopeless romantics approach dating as if they might meet their soul mate. This only adds to the uncomfortableness. In the long run, both parties are hoping for long-term success, or at least a second date, but will it happen?

2. The Dates

In real life, first dates are causal. Think coffee, an average dinner or even activity-based dates such as mini golf or bowling. The goal is to get to know this person, and make clear judgments as to whether they should or shouldn’t be a part of your life.

3. Relationship Progress

Ah, date four has arrived. It’s time to get physical and talk seriously, right? Where do we go from here? Should we be staying at each other’s places? Do we start talking about our long-term goals?

4. Expectations

Are you both on the same page? It’s also time to set boundaries, and truly decide who is looking for what. This is when couples realize if they are both looking for the same elements in a relationship. Things could even get a little sticky here.

5. Happily ever after?

Will this relationship lead to more? In real life we are ultimately searching for the one, otherwise why bother right? These relationships either come to a halt or become permanent, depending on whether someone’s expectations are met.

“All relationships end badly, otherwise they wouldn’t end”.Cocktail, 1988

The Evolved Sugar Lifestyle

dating an older man

1. Icebreakers

Starting a sugar relationship is easier than you think. Most introductions occur because both people are looking for a mutual relationship. You can skip pretenses, unknown expectations and avoid the typical nerves. For the most part, both people know what is coming next.

2. The Dates

Dates range from casual to downright outlandish. Many Sugar Babies enter an arrangement to embrace the finer things in life, so the first date could include a range of extraordinary elements.

3. Relationship Progress

Relationship progression may or may not happen, and that is ok. Hey, some Sugar Babies marry their Sugar Daddy, while others only meet them once. The beauty of the sugar lifestyle is that people do not join the site with set relationship expectations.

4. Expectations

Sugar Daddies love mutually beneficial relationships because they can also be referred to as a “relationships on your terms.” Both people have the freedom to end things when they wish.

5. Happily ever after?

Yes, this happens, but it is subjective. As we previously stated, happily ever after does not have to suggest marriage. A happy sugar arrangement could mean two individuals who want a discreet relationship with the option to come and go as they please. After all, happily ever after is all about freedom and mutual goals.

Did you choose a sugar lifestyle or a traditional relationship? Have you actively been pursuing both? We’d love to hear your stories –hold nothing back.

Leave a Reply

160 Responses to “Sugar Vs. Traditional: Should you have your cake or eat it?”

  1. SDLKN4SBTCSN says:

    The real difference between traditional and a sugar relationship is in a traditional relationship sex is a choice for the woman and a chore for the man. What I mean is he has to earn his gift. You can’t enter into a traditional relationship saying “if you don’t give it up after the third date we are done.” Thats an Ahole. But a sugar relationship evens the field a bit and allows the man to dictate more of the terms in regards to intimacy. All of the expectations are or should be explained upfront on both sides. It makes for a more stress free relationship which is more enjoyable for both.

  2. DarkHorseSD says:

    It is not true that Josh is referring to a small subset of SBs on SA. It is an overwhelming majority – although you don’t have to meet them constantly after wading through profiles.

    Many women that sound good are getting quickly turned off, canceling their profiles or refusing to log in anymore after a short time.

    SA does not focus on quality at all. Numbers are its only metric. Within a couple of weeks, the two millionth profile will be created.

    The value proposition for the non-escort-lite seeking SDs is very much in question and jeopardy.

  3. Josh says:

    @JD: You’ve got it other SBs need to learn/understand that an important part of SBs “work” is to continue to charm their SDs into doing things for them instead of demanding and nagging him into doing stuff. He got/gets the latter two from his ex or present “significant other” all the time and he does not need an SB to elevate his blood pressure…LOL!

  4. Jersey Darling says:

    I have a talent for turning a phrase with my tongue, one of my more endearing qualities 😉

  5. Josh says:


    You sure are a flirty, sassy darling of an SB. The kind I like. Flirt with me the right way and I may turn into your obedient little puppy. Hahaha!

    I wouldn’t mind mentoring you at all. 😉

  6. Jersey Darling says:

    Well Josh, re: your actress rewrite I think the answer is simple. Just because you are accomplished doesn’t mean you don’t want to be *more* accomplished. And yes, a director/producer can benefit from the drive of the actress 😉 Her acting will likely be superior and make the film a better product.

    And to your question to SDs about how often they’ve been approached for mentorship, I can’t speak for them of course but it’s one of the first things that comes up when I contact an SD. Usually I’m attracted to entrepreneurs and have to stop myself from talking too much about professional matters lest I bore them. It’s equally rare to find the SD that actually wants to take the time to mentor versus the SD who just wants sex.

  7. Josh says:


    “Well @ Josh ex sd was providing but failed miserably to get those electrics shooting….so there you have it, something’s boil down to physical attraction !”

    Well, a well-rounded test contains both positive testing and negative testing. 😉

    What you described above is an example of negative testing.

    Do you care to answer my question in relation to your current SD? That would be the all necessary positive testing. 😉

    Many Thanks

  8. Josh says:

    @Experienced SDs:

    JD raised an important point about SB seeking mentorship (which I believe is nothing more than Brandon’s slick MIT-trained marketing).

    1) How many of your SBs have reached out to you for mentorship?

    2) What were their circumstances? and

    3) How exactly did you mentor them?

  9. Josh says:


    You seem to be a sweet young lady, so please don’t take anything I write as personal or disrespectful. The intent is to hash out various important components of the SB/SD space.

    You wrote:

    “Some SBs are highly educated, have great careers and want more. These SBs have many of the same characteristics of successful SDs – they are driven and ambitious and have goals to reach. Arrangements can be a good complement to their goals. SBs like this usually appreciate a mentor and the business expertise of their SDs.

    The question is why WOULDN’T you want a woman like that in your life?”

    Thanks for your interesting response. Please allow me to change a few words around and see how it reads? 😉

    “Some actresses are highly educated, have great careers (not related to acting) and want more. These actresses have many of the same characteristics of successful directors/producers – they are driven and ambitious and have goals to reach. Lead role in your A movie can be a good complement to their goals. Actresses like this usually appreciate a mentor and the business expertise of their directors/producers.

    The question is why WOULDN’T you want an actress like that in your movie?”

    I am not sure how would that fly with the director/producer. If the actress in front of him is already accomplished, then they would not need his mentorship. He would gladly sign a multi-million dollar contract with franchise options.

    If the actress in front of him is not an accomplished actress then he would want to know what could she do for him for his upcoming movie, and if she is NOT an accomplished star she will probably get SAG negotiated rates.

    If they did have “great careers” they may not be interested in becoming SBs. And if they have really really GREAT careers, then they probably are out of my filtering age, so I would never have the pleasure of their aging company. LOL!

    And this stuff about mentors and all is Brandon’s slick marketing. Keep in mind he is no dummy. He is an MIT graduate. 😉

    So far none of my 20+ year-old SBs have asked me for mentorship even though I have an MBA and a great career; and I am more than twice their age. I have had escalating demands for allowance, but no mentorship requests yet. I am sure I will get one in the future. I am keeping my fingers crossed. LOL!

  10. Bella says:

    Well @ Josh ex sd was providing but failed miserably to get those electrics shooting….so there you have it, something’s boil down to physical attraction !

  11. Jersey Darling says:

    @Bella – I wish I could help you answer your question but the answer to this one lies within you. It seems like you’ve already found it.

  12. Jersey Darling says:

    Oh Josh. I’ll be the first SB to answer:

    “I have a simple “rhetorical” question . . . Most of the SBs I have met are either waitresses in not-so-fancy restaurants or are working in some kind of low-paying medical job. What makes you think that an SD should drop thousands upon thousands on you…? “

    Your question demonstrates two things:
    1) You are meeting a small subset of SBs that are not an accurate sample of the rest of the population
    2) You’re overgeneralizing.

    Some SBs are highly educated, have great careers and want more. These SBs have many of the same characteristics of successful SDs – they are driven and ambitious and have goals to reach. Arrangements can be a good complement to their goals. SBs like this usually appreciate a mentor and the business expertise of their SDs.

    The question is why WOULDN’T you want a woman like that in your life?

  13. Josh says:


    “when I look at my current sd’s photo, it sends electric like vibrations shooting through my body, his even managed to make me blush (now tell me how many guys are able to get a black girl to blush ? ;)”

    I am not challenging that the above is not true today. But absent sugar, would the above will still hold true?

  14. flyr says:

    @Bella – Just kidding about the priorities(:

    Solve this riddle – a mediocre choice is better than the choice of no choice

  15. SD-rob says:

    @bella-interesting that you continued dating but were intimate with only him. So you never liked any of the other guys you dated? If you had would you have dropped your sd? I don’t follow the logic?

  16. Bella says:

    @ sd Rob, I have never been exclusive with my sd, although I know in the time I have been with him, I have not been intimate with another man, when we initially met, I did say to him that he could carry on dating and so would I, I mean we both should keep out options open since we both are single ( I’m very traditional and ideally I prefer to be married, but until I’m married I’m not giving up on sugar) I was once bitten I had to heal a broken heart regretting my time invested in this relationship and no sugar on top of it all, I don’t want a repeat of this ( It’s silly for anyone to think sugar is my only motivation,that’s like me saying sex is the only motivation from the guy, after all no man will accept to be in a relationship were sex isn’t provided for, raise your hand if you’re a man and can live on love alone, no sex?) these relationships are a give and take, even in RL ) I’m being open with what I want, by both of us providing for the other in what we both deem satisfactory, it leaves only room for more fun, no drama and suspicion I believe this is what made our arrangement good, I was happy with what he was providing and I’m sure because of that, he equally was getting a good deal from moi 😉
    And sd rob being a GF is just as demanding as being his wife. There is no difference In fact I believe girlfriends put out more than wives, yet if anything happened, wives will be covered not the girlfriend. Also his got the choice to stick with the SB arrangement ,so it’s not as if I’m pushing him , his demanding more, so I’m equally stating what would work,problem is some men want all the benefits,I’m happy with this but give the girl all her benefits too, I like a fair game, so yes I would expect more allowance for being the Girlfriend, I do care for him and that’s whybi find it hard to tell him about the increase in allowance ( I’m going to do it but not sure the best way to do it,I just want him to understand we all are investing time into this,it should be both worth our time)

    @ Josh…. Well if you are reading my message and choosing to put your own meaning to my words then that’s fine, but I choose not to get in a discussion were I feel, you’re just choosing to twist things for your own entertainment ( You’re in the mind that I’m looking for ways to make guys fall in love? I’ve already got these h dancing anyway, it hasn’t been through tricks, it’s purely been because his making me happy too, because of that, I’m radiating good energy that’s making both of us tick, that’s the d) you can play all the tricks in the game but if your energy is saying otherwise it will be felt. That’s why I’m saying unless I have my arrangement increased, reason being I will be ultimately u more than double the time I’m spending with him now, just as men dont want to feel like they’re buying us, I don’t want to feel used for my time too .like his getting the better deal and bl me, hence my energy will be vibrating all sorts of negativity, which I don’t want to happen. It’s a difficult situation as we are so perfect together, we both care, but this shouldn’t mean I shouldn’t with my values. 😉
    Sd rob I had a married sd once, I had to break it off because it almost caused a divorce, I hate to be the cause of breaking up m, it was great till he begun falling for me, sadly I didn’t feel a great chemistry with him as I do my current , when I look at my current sd’s photo, it sends electric like vibrations shooting through my body, his even managed to make me blush (now tell me how many guys are able to get a black girl to blush ? 😉
    @ flyer … Sorry but I have to clear this or else there won’t be any oral activity on my part 🙂

  17. Josh says:

    For all those road warriors or residents for that matter, which US cities in your opinion have the best-looking SBs who are willing to make arrangements at “reasonable” monthly allowance levels?

    I know that “reasonable” is vague and subjective, but please respond based on your experience.

    I don’t want to get down to specific dollar amounts because the discussion may get into “dangerous” territory, but if you must, you may use SA’s categorization for those amounts.

    I wanna know so that if I pass by those cities I will see what is available. Who knows, I may just move to one of those cities. LOL!

  18. Josh says:


    My aplogies. No personal attack or disrespect intended.

    I had thought my reference to Shakespeare was more of a tongue and cheek phrase. Again, NO pun intended. LOL!

  19. Josh says:


    I am cool with your description and analogy. And I am not into any long-term monogamous arrangement with any SB. That beats the purpose of the “marketplace.” 😉

  20. gentle(man)soul says:


    I reiterate ,sugar life is for whatever you want . Your desires are limited only by the availability of someone who is willing to fulfill them . This is a marketplace just like E Bay or Amazon . Prospective SBs and SDs put up our ads (profile ) ,interview candidates ,and enroll the winner .

  21. SD-Rob says:

    @ flyr – well put about place looking empty and looking forward to the next time. The exception for me was when I had multiple and I was looking forward to the next one next week.
    It has of course totally changed with my decision to go for exclusive monogamous SB.

  22. SD-Rob says:

    @ SD-Guru- the reason why my Sugar relationships did not last was my tendency to jump from one SB to another and what made it easy was I chose SB who were basically looking for the same. They did not care if the basically had a one night stand with me, and i did not either and was not after exclusivity. Some hoped for more meetings and we had as many as 3 or so, but I moved on. All the girls were quite pretty with nice bodies, very sexual, and anywhere from 18-35. By the way, Almost all with jobs and again only one was probably a pro. I provided sugar as they wanted , never cheated any out of that. This site is great for such activity. This does not include another dozen or so that I communicated with and a few more that I met but decided not to take further.

    After a bunch of such “arrangements” , a misnomer really, I decided I wanted something more regular with a SB who was also looking for a single SD in an exclusive arrangement, 30+ , who I could connect better with. This has led to emotional attachment. Almost sounds like Bella’s situation with her SD probably in the early stages? Difference is I am married and if my SB expects more and I’m having a great time with her , I could not go down that path whether GF BF or more as long as I’m tied down. And my wife does elevate my blood pressure , lol, but I’m waiting until my kids are independent. In the meantime , my SB my want to move along once she is done with her grad school and returns to her job. She actually has said that she would not need sugar once she is back working if we are still together.
    @ Bella – curious as to if you and your SD were exclusive all along ? Must be now I would imagine and at least after some time from the beginning ?
    Sounds like the sugar is really a key part of the relationship for you so hard to move away from sugar arrangement. Why not tell him directly about your concerns? That you need to be taken care of the same way , no matter how the relationship evolves. Would you want more sugar as you move to GF BF? Is one of your concerns the amount of time you have to spend with him and all the other commitments? Does not sound like it since you are ok with marriage which requires even more of that.
    I think if you just tell him that you need to be taken care of the same way as now, he is ok with that what is the difference to you ?

  23. Flyer says:

    “What I find to be most disheartening is that a big percentage of SD’s view SB’s as escorts”

    I think the term big percentage is overstated . A number have commented that they are looking for something more . In the immortal words of Clinton advisor dick Morris when asked if it were true he paid for women to come over and have sex told the startled reporter ” absolutely no, I paid for them to leave when I was done”……………

    . To me the difference is that sugar is about being with someone whom you like and want to be with beyond sex. The place seems a little empty when they leave and you are already looking forward to the next meeting or just a call to catch up.

    Obviously others have a different approach and the challenge for the Sb is to match her wants with the right sd candidate.

  24. Flyer says:

    Bella. How dare you interrupt an important discussion of oral sex with this stuff about love.

    “security ) if I’m honest I prefer sticking to the old arrangement of meeting once a week, the new arrangement his suggesting I’m not comfortable with it unless he wants marriage I don’t think I want to play girlfriends it’s as demanding as being a wife only problem is the wife is covered whilst the girlfriend is not. I want to be covered”

    My guess is that 80% of your sister Sb s would love to have the girlfriend relationship with the Sb cash flow. Yes there should be an understanding that your sugar should not be eaten by the ants of gf expenses. As to security how much security are you giving up. You heart has already departed the conventional sugar relationship.

    I want everything is a relationship destroying attitude that can creep into the heart of wonderful people snatching defeat from the jaws of victory. Yes do talk about a silver parachute but be humble.

    The upside is a storybook ending and the downside is return to where you are now should he depart .

  25. Melissa says:

    @ josh – Your thoughts aren’t particularly thought-provoking, at least for me. They are simply naive and misogynist.” That post was addressed you by Richard not me. So I don’t know what you’re on about.

    I guess you may go back to your regularly scheduled contemplation of “To swish cum or not to swish cum.” LOL!

    Please refrain from addressing me if you are going to be rude and immature!

  26. Josh says:


    After posting the last message I realized that some of it may be construed as personal attack. So please accept my apologies.

    I like you a lot because you seem to be a straightshooter, and I hope that my writing style does make you feel that I am attacking you personally, which is not the intention AT ALL. 🙂

  27. Josh says:

    @SD Guru:

    I am sincerely grateful to your rhetorical answer to my rhetorical question. 😉

    By the way, are you the same person who wrote series of articles on the SB space in the 2010-2012 on your personal blog.

    If you did then I am really honored to be communicating with you. I learned a lot about this space from you. 🙂

  28. Josh says:


    The reeason you make him feel the way you do is that you are working your arrangement the way it should have been worked. Kudos to you for giving him his money’s worth!!!

    Women are usually full of themselves…So get over possibility of permanence of your ability to drive him crazy, let alone driving a larger number of men crazy.

    You will definitely NOT perform your magic in different circumstances, when you are his GF or worse his wife, when your bad behavior will have the potential to land you 50% of his net worth.

    So don’t ruin it for you or him. Help keep the sugar space larger and larger… LOL!

  29. Josh says:


    “Ah ha! SO! There IS a plot.”

    The sugar space is about brutal honesty…

    Regardless of what any woman says, there always is a plot in EVERY woman’s mind. Unless she is independently rich, she is getting older with every passing day and her vagina is not as productive or desirable with every passing day.

    I am glad that Bella is open and honest about it. 😉

    Her “plot” is to keep the sugar going based on current arrangement OR get married and collect at the tail end of the eventual collapse of the marriage, which SHE will cause by sabotaging it, and then filing for a divorce; like up to 90% of women do. 😉

    My vote is to keep the arrangement going. GF situation is to her detriment and the marriage situation is to his detriment.

  30. Bella says:

    @Sd Guru, well rushing him is not my intention, all I’m saying is I’m very happy just being the sb ( it works for me and I’m not putting out as much as I would as girlfriend or wife, I’m comfortable) all I’m saying is his suggested the girlfriend thing, and yes I love and care deeply for him, however, the girlfriend thing just doesn’t work for me, Marriage would as we would both be having 50/50 of what we want) his single I have never discussed marriage with him and actually do not intend to, that’s why I’m finding it hard to let him know that, as much as the girlfriend idea sounds appealing , there is no security in it for me, he doesn’t want the whole previous sb arrangement, how can I get him to give allowance I would consider enough to go a head with the new girlfriend arrangement ? Without making him feel as if his buying my love lol ( come on il be putting out a lot too so honestly it’s mutual) he often tells me no one ever made him feel the way I do( I wish I knew what I’m doing to make him feel that way) I’m tempted to ask 😉 honestly a part from the chemistry we have together I wouldn’t particularly say I’m that girl who knows how to make men go crazy in love ( I know I’m physically attractive but I also know that alone doesn’t cut it) so me saying I prefer marriage instead of the girlfriend route doesn’t mean I’m suggesting or hinting he does this. It means his offer of girlfriend looks good on cover but would lead to tears if it didn’t come with a good cheque to compensate for whatever happens … So sd Guru being the Guru, can you advice on what I can do, I will need a better deal before I sign myself up for this.

  31. DarkHorseSD says:

    Ah ha! SO! There IS a plot.

  32. Josh says:


    I know that the following is kind of simplistic, but here are my two cents about similar situations…(NOT necessarily yours)

    If your wife is not a nag, keep her for as long as it lasts…

    If your kids are too young…be careful until they are independent…

    Organize finances for the eventuality…

    As long as the wife does not elevate your blood pressure too much, keep her around…

    Once kids and finances are where you want them to be then get a divorce and play SD SD until you don’t desire the woman’s body…

    If you need company after you are sexually done, even with the help of viagra, then find someone who does not raise your blood press too much.

    Kick the can knowing that you played hard…;)

  33. MissBabyJ says:

    So, it seems like my first POT has turned into my first poofer! I posted about this guy (messaging me then disappearing)on the previous blog, and last week he got back in touch. We arranged to meet tonight, and I gave him my phone number. He said he’d text yesterday to arrange a place and time. We exchanged a few messages on here over the weekend, but I heard nothing from him yesterday. I messaged him to ask what the plan was for tonight – at the time of writing (3 pm UK time) he still hasn’t read that message – but he was on here earlier this morning!
    Looks like I’m washing my hair tonight…

  34. Josh says:

    I have a simple “rhetorical” question for the articulate and not-so-articulate SBs

    Most of the SBs I have met are either waitresses in not-so-fancy restaurants or are working in some kind of low-paying medical job.

    What makes you think that an SD should drop thousands upon thousands on you just because he has access to your vagina a few times a month, which you do give away for free when you are not with him? 😉

    • SD Guru says:


      To answer your rhetorical question, because he can, and because he wants to. :mrgreen:

      “Am I ready to leave my marriage and if so for what exactly?”

      I’ll repeat what I wrote earlier regarding your situation. If you intend to stay in your marriage then NSA is the way to go. If you don’t intend to stay in your marriage then get a divorce and play the field. Don’t let your current SB (or any SB) influence that decision because she may or may not be the one you want to be with if you were single. Divorce alone is messy enough, you don’t need a SB to add to the drama and complexity. There were examples on the blog in years past involving married SD’s who were going to live happily ever after with their SB’s but things rarely turn out as planned.

      “In fact, of the 10 SB I have ended up having only 2 went through a first non sexual meeting and then had sex with me on the second meet.”

      If things usually start out well for you with a SB, what do you think is the reason that your sugar relationships don’t last?

      “the new arrangement his suggesting I’m not comfortable with it unless he wants marriage”

      Let’s see, you’re both in love, you want to be his SB or wife but not a gf. I don’t know his background but let’s look at it from his perspective. Does he want a wife and is he ready for a wife? Forget the sugar aspect for a moment, you’re in the same predicament as many women who are in a relationship and wonder what it takes to get to “wife” status. You can rush him but it’s going to take some time. He’ll be ready when he’s ready.

  35. SD-Rob says:

    @ Gentle – ” Why ? the old age dilemma … you might not want to stay married but don’t let end with a bang”
    Yes, indeed for a married SD it is tough proposition. One has to wonder why married SD get lured to this site. Or for that matter why they stray in any form at all. IMO , for some because they inherently cannot be monogamous since the concept of monogamy is one that society has imposed on us. So, no matter how loving their wives, they want more. For some like me who had always embraced monogamy and expected it both ways, it is because of MAJOR deficiencies in the married life. Of course, that could be resolved through a divorce, but there are issues such as kids , financial , etc. Of course, it may be inevitable but the timing is the issue.
    Given the constraints of married life then it is hard in either case to seek others in an open fashion , even when you do have opportunities like I do when traveling. There is the issue of meeting someone somewhere , then having them be ok with the fact that you are married and looking outside for either one of the reasons above and having them be ok with it in a normal situation!! Hence we seek easier means where the pot partners are on the same page. Ashley Madison is one of course , which is also filled with SBs by the way. There the quality of non SB women is not as high as SA and you still could end up having to spoil them with $ and TIME which you don’t have. Hence SA where expectations are clear, women are younger and much more desirable. But then there is the $$ aspect.
    You try and check emotions in place but you start receiving what you are lacking at home which is not just sex (sex is an important part of it) , but companionship in the precious hours or days you may have with your SB. Of course, if you are in it just for the “bang” then it is just the sex. You feel like a John and see your SB as an escort. On the other hand, maybe that is the best way for a married SD as you imply. In my case, initially the sex made up for all that was missing in my marriage , but after tasting lots of sugar which was exciting (and a good being had on both sides), you feel empty still for the companionship, and something more.
    So it brings you to the inevitable , that is , does one want to stay in his marriage or not. And for what does one consider giving it all up including the comfort of a home with the kids nicely settled in, and when (9once the kids are out, etc? For a SB that you click with so nicely it feels like a BF GF relationship? The SB also sees the issue. She wants to be with you more, wants to spend more time together. Be spontaneous as opposed to constant planning around your schedule mainly. And she sees no future or uncertain future for herself unless the marriage issue is settled. Will this guy ever see anything long term with her?
    The above is the harder part of sugar vs what I experienced through the major middle part of my sugar experience which was easier non emotionally intensive part which was not fulfilling. Now that I am in an relationship that I almost had with my first SB and have wanted from the beginning, your question is a good one. Am I ready to leave my marriage and if so for what exactly? Is it more than a “bang” ? I think so, but how much more and is it eventually worth it? To find out for sure I need to spend more time and freely with my SB, to learn more, compatibility etc, in real life situations, not the dream dating time we have together, but to do so I need freedom away from my marriage, which js not possible without leaving it, but would it be worth to leave it?
    So it is a catch 22 … So much simpler the way you are doing it Gentle and how I was for some time …

  36. gentle(man)soul says:


    Tell him you love him too but you like things the way they are. Take it or leave it .

    If it is true love then your relationship will evolve naturally .

  37. Josh says:


    I am NOT saying that I will continue forever if she chooses not to put out within fre weeks. Actually, this is the first SB whom I have not slept within the first or the second meeting. 😉

    I just like her too much to not give her enough space to come around herself. We do all kind of horsing around though. 😉

  38. Josh says:

    @Bella: Don’t go to the dark side. LOL!

    This love stuff is for the birds, literally. Being an SD’s wife is bad, being a GF is worse.

    It’s not him who will change afterwards. It’s you who will mess it up, royally.

    Time to get your resume out, so to speak. 🙂

  39. Bella says:

    Hi everyone please advice needed.
    I have been seeing a SD for a year now, his very generous and we both are physically attracted to each other( it’s not easy to find a sd you genuinely feel attracted to in my past experience majority were gross, sorry ) so I really feel blessed to have a guy who not only is generous and romantic, we have a great chemistry. Anyhow we recently had a big wake up call, basically although we both fell in love I hadn’t really expressed this to him, his expressed his love for me etc, this then made me get distant with him, I was scared I would fall in love and loose the plot, the only way I knew to protect myself was to pull away from him, in doing so I hurt him so bad, he called the whole thing off. Anyhow we didn’t see each other for almost a month in that time we only met once to dicuss what went wrong, he was so upset and hurt that he couldn’t listen to anything I said. Well last week we met again, our feelings for each other were undeniable and he confessed he loved me and wants to have me as girlfriend, he will still provide for me financially but he doesn’t want the clinical stuff that arrangements come with, eg things were not particularly spontaneous because we saw each other once a week except if we were off on vacation, he says it’s always felt like he was in charge of where we went on holiday, he now says he would love me to choose where ever I want to go etc. basically he wants things like a proper relationship, it all sounds good to me because I’m actually in love too, my only problem is I want to cover my ass and not catch myself caught up in this love game then loose the plot, I want some kind of commitment because i will be technically spending and doing things I wouldn’t do unless I had a ring on it, can anyone advise on how I can say to him this girlfriend thing is demanding I want something more as I feel il be putting out a lot more, it’s really hard to explain it as I genuinely love him too, I have been bitten in the past and regretted it, I wouldn’t like to repeat that. If anything happens I want to feel that, I’m compensated. His asked me to tell him what I want financially , I’m afraid to raise the whole idea of me wanting some kind of commitment thing ( security ) if I’m honest I prefer sticking to the old arrangement of meeting once a week, the new arrangement his suggesting I’m not comfortable with it unless he wants marriage I don’t think I want to play girlfriends it’s as demanding as being a wife only problem is the wife is covered whilst the girlfriend is not. I want to be covered…. Advice will be appreciated, sorry I have rumbled on a bit and excuse the typos English isn’t my first language ( shouldn’t be an excuse, although it would help if it was my first )

  40. SD-Rob says:

    @ Gentle- being ok with not having sex was my initial approach , but I was quickly spoiled the other way since every single one of the SB wanted to have sex in the first or at latest second meet. In fact, of the 10 SB I have ended up having only 2 went through a first non sexual meeting and then had sex with me on the second meet. And I know only one was possibly a pro. The rest all had jobs (they had schedule our meets after work), I even googled a couple and I know they had jobs and careers as they said. Since I flew them to me at times I knew their names etc. Current one that is the longest, I know quite well as to what she does , where she lives etc. very much a regular girl, no where near an escort.

    Much of sex so early had to do with the SB desiring the sex, getting very much into it. This is another major difference between SB and escorts , in that they want to try new stuff, multiples, long sessions, truly as if you were having sex with a GF. An escort wants you in and out , watches the clock, will ask for extra if you want extra stuff. I only had one SB who I saw for a matter of literally half an hour and that was it and I’m convinced she was a pro pretending to be a student.
    Also, not sure what the $ arrangement of one without sex is vs one with. I would figure it is less without vs with, in general, but there could be exceptions. Then one can up the amount although transactional, it only makes sense in terms of an arrangement. But again, I have never had to worry about such a transition since it got sexual almost immediately.

  41. gentle(man)soul says:


    ” I don’t care if we had sex during our 5th meeting or the 10th. I just enjoy how she flirts with me and how she makes me feel good while I am around her.”

    Hmmm –I’ve always scoffed at the suggestion that SDs aren’t always interested in sex . You are the first ,so it DOES happen . Each to his own . I don’t get it . Now if a guy is impotent I can see that ,but there are other sexual things to do .


    BBBJCIM Yuck ! I must be un American but I do not get a girl wanting to swish and swallow. And kissing a girl after swallowing my junk turns me off . And I don’t particularly care for BJs . Go figure ? We are all different .

  42. Josh says:


    Didn’t mean to confuse you. My post was addressed to you because you had written earlier “@Josh – Your thoughts aren’t particularly thought-provoking, at least for me. They are simply naive and misogynist.”

    Since my thoughts through a series of posts above were not “particularly thought-provoking” to you, and were basically “naive and misogynist” I thought that maybe those pearls of wisdom coming from a female you admire might provoke some thoughts.

    That’s all…I guess you may go back to your regularly scheduled contemplation of “To swish cum or not to swish cum.” LOL!

    I have posted my response earlier that I am NOT into body fluid exchange unless I am in a monogamous relationship AND both of us are tested AND my partner is willing to do something I am interested in.

    I am a VERY easy-going SD and my interaction with my SBs is based on mutual respect of our pre-negotiated MBA and I am not into sneaking things in our arrangement, which is detrimental to the other party. 🙂

  43. Melissa says:

    @ Josh- how do those pearls of wisdom apply in my case of not wanting a guy to cum in my mouth? Am I missing something? I’m confused:-)

  44. Josh says:


    It is no different than what happens in Los Angeles where god knows how many girls descend every year to become superstars. To make it in Hollywood, you not only need looks but also talent.

    Same here. It is not about your (generic) pussy or the sensuality surrounding it. It is about your talent to search, find, contact, and charm one or more SDs to support the lifestyle you are looking for.

    You (generic) are not going to get $1,000 shoes from your SD just because you have certain measurements, or how much pre-conceived idea you have picked up from this site’s marketing or other SBs about your P.E.R.

    It is about how you charm your POT initially or already arranged SD on a continued basis.

    It is NOT the kind of “work” escorts do but it is work nonetheless. I have met my current SB four times already. I have immensely enjoyed her company and she has enjoyed mine. We have NOT had sex yet so I don’t know what kind of P.E.R. she is working with, or if she is working with any.

    I don’t care if we had sex during our 5th meeting or the 10th. I just enjoy how she flirts with me and how she makes me feel good while I am around her. Would I pay her more than what our current arrangement is? Absolutely, without second thought, if I could afford it.

    Actually, if we stayed together I will increase her allowance gradually to a significant amount because I will close some business deals in Summer. Have I promised that to her yet? NO. I believe in under-promising and over-delivering.

    Every SB/SD arrangement is different. Make yours wisely. The SBs who consider sugar arrangements as “work” do better compared to those who take it as some kind of entitlement because Brandon put some cool TV, Internet or print ads out to attract you (generic).

  45. gtt_envy says:

    @Josh, finding real SD’s that can actually provide that type of “P.E.R” are so few and far between you might have a better chance getting struck by lightning. Especially when you start seeing how often these girls are scammed, lied too, and pretty much offered what a escort is, but the “fake sd” wants 4-6hrs of her time for the measly $250 he offers.

  46. Josh says:


    I found these pearls of wisdom, apparently written by a woman, in a different thread on this site. Enjoy. 🙂

    “It isn’t the label, per se, it’s the experience (shopping at Chanel is a whole better universe of service than shopping at the gap, and quality clothes feel sexier against your skin.)

    I’d never buy designer duds for myself (when I’m buying I head straight to the very practical sale racks at Anne Taylor or Banana Republic) but I sure do think it’s a turn on to be pampered with a ridiculously luxurious pair of shoes – and I have a college education’s worth of handbags, wallets, and sparklies.

    But, my sugar game is different. I don’t need assistance or help with tuition – I just think it’s sexy when a guy wants to bang me so badly he’d drop $$$$ on some gift that has little value other than the P.E.R (pussy exchange rate). It’s knowing that my vagina (and surrounding sensuality) is a very, very expensive and highly sought after commodity.”

  47. gentle(man)soul says:

    @ Rob

    ” I have migrated away from desperate SB who want all their needs financed on sugar, to those who have jobs and need the $ for life style enhancement ”

    That is my ideal too . I no longer have the freedom of movement of self and funds to indulge myself with a “true SB ” ,that is a monogamous loving relationship in which sex and money aren’t the only focus . I can’t spend hours or nights away with my Baby doing things that couples do . Now I am left with quick encounters in the shadows which are primarily sexual .

    Why ? The age old dilemma all married SDs have –discovery and monitoring that ensues in the aftermath . So be careful playing around . You might not want to stay married but don’t let it end with a bang .

  48. SD-Rob says:

    @ gentle- if one takes further of course you get into the discussion about girlfriend vs escort, even a trophy wife , etc.
    I have bounced back and forth as you say, but one difference I have found at least is whether you are doing all this with one SB and one SD or multiple. If your SB is entertaining several or more then it is more like an escort situation. If the relationship is exclusive then it is more like a GF situation. Btw, I have migrated away from desperate SB who want all their needs financed on sugar, to those who have jobs and need the $ for life style enhancement. They are then less likely to be jumping around. Also, how much they let you into their lives, and what background they come from, how close they are to their family, etc separates and thickens the escort line … At least for me.

  49. sweetie says:

    Gentle, very interesting indeed. What’s the difference, right? Thin line.

  50. gentle(man)soul says:


    ” certain SB and SD that view this an an escort site and go about it that way. They feed off each other and then spread the virus ”

    It’s easy to feel superior and righteous about your own needs over others . The escort discussion has been debated ad nauseum in these pages ,but the bottom line is

    “who cares ?”

    The beauty of Sugar dating is that there is something here for everyone . PTP ,monthly allowance,sex,no sex, cum in mouths ,no oral ,no anal ,and on and on . Rob, I like your thoughts so I am not dissing you ,but everyone has their own agenda and preconceived notions about life and dating .

    I have evolved from having a true love SB I would have married if circumstances were different–to needing a PTP for an hour here and there . Escort ? SB ? Whatever . I do know that I want exclusivity ,so I don’t want to hire an escort for that reason . So is my SB an escort because I pay her to sleep with me ? IF I take her out to dinner and to Saks for a shopping trip then sleep with her does that make it right ? Who knows ?

  51. Josh says:

    @SD-Rob: What you are seeking in an SB is definitely an expensive proposition. However, I would rather use some soap instead of going to escorts. LOL!

    In my case, I prefer SBs who have decent work ethics to hold reasonably sustainable job(s) and are here because they want extra money for whatever. These SBs also know how hard it is to earn a dollar.

    Those SBs are much more reasonable in their demands compared to those who look at SDs for 100% of their expenses while providing company only a few times a month.

    You never know how many SDs they are seeing other than you (generic) because they have all their day avaiable to maximize what their body may generate ( escorts of different type?) compared to those hard-working souls whom I seek. LOL!

  52. SD-Rob says:

    Sorry for the typos but off my phone !

  53. SD-Rob says:

    @Elaine- you hit the nail on the head by asking the chicken or egg question. I think there are certain SB and SD that view this an an escort site and go about it that way. They feed off each other and then spread the virus as other SD and SB become jaded having fallen for them, and it becomes a downward spiral where it is hard to find or filter for ones who indeed want what I thought would be a traditional arrangement or better yet relationship akin to having a mistress. I have sifted through dozens of SBs to find my current one who tells me that she is most happy thinking of herself as my mistress, we are exclusive and having a great time on both sides and if it evolves into more then so be it. But again, it has been very hard for me to find that (curiously for her it has been very easy since I’m her first SD off the site). Of course, being in a bid city may be part of the reason for having to filter through so many.
    By the way, IME experience this site if used as an escort site would be a very expensive way of going about it compared to what you see advertised on the net for escorts.

  54. KatPaw says:

    @josh nope sorry not an SB that married a SD.. Just a woman who married her love and other half. We are in an open marriage so I decided to go the sugar route for the upfront honesty of it. I’m married and plan to stay so.

  55. Elaine says:

    @ Melisa,
    I don’t think you are a prude,if you don’t like the taste of cum in your mouth. Everybody has his preferences and limits, that’s ok as long as they are respected. Sex should be about MUTUAL pleasure, right?

    Don’t really get it when one of the partners is pushing the other to do something she/he obviously doesn’t like to. How can one enjoy such an enforced “act”? Ok, different maybe in a BDSM relationship 😉

    “What I find to be most disheartening is that a big percentage of SD’s view SB’s as escorts”

    Again I fully agree on this….but at the other side;
    Is a big percentage of SB not acting like escorts?
    Treating SD’s as John’s or ATM machines?

    It allready starts with the profiles and the pics, what kind of men do some SB’s think to attract !?
    And of course the “escorts turned SB’s” are not really helping either. 🙁

    So, if this kind of “SD” wouldn’t find on SA what he is looking for (sort of bargain escort) he would leave discouraged after a few turned down attempts, wouldn’t he?

    Think it is a matter of; “what came first, the chicken or the egg?”…

  56. Melissa says:

    @Sugary-good to see you back Mi darling:-) you know I love hearing your 2 cents. I used to follow your blog and have read almost all your posts here and If my memory serves me right ( and pls correct me if I’m wrong) threesomes is not your thing? That doesn’t make you a prude does it? I on the other hand wouldn’t mind (someday) exploring a woman. I la la la love sex but cum in my mouth ? That revelation makes me cringe for the same exact reason as KatPaw.

    @Sweetie and kindred- thank you ladies, I don’t want to think of myself as a prude either:-)

    @Flyer- I think it’s (fixation on swallowing) more likely a power trip or even the need to make you “dirty ” in his eyes.

    I figured as much. Ultimately each has the right to leave the relationship if their needs are not being met. And like onyx put it “i’ll tell him no. If it’s a deal breaker it’s a deal breaker, his loss.

    @gtt_envy-If you are already giving him head well…your STD risk is well you know…
    I made an appointment to see my Doc next week, I want to breath easy:-( What I find to be most disheartening is that a big percentage of SD’s view SB’s as escorts.

    @SD guru- Matters in the bedroom usually come down to personal preference. But a better question is, why should you keep him?

    I want to think about this long and hard.

    @Richard @Josh – Your thoughts aren’t particularly thought-provoking, at least for me. They are simply naive and misogynist.

    How do i whistle on the blog? Lol!

  57. Dr. Evil says:

    Since many new women on the site come to this blog it’s good to have Josh’s attitudes on the blog. It let’s them know what some of the men will be like when they start meeting SD’s.

  58. Josh says:

    @KatPaw: Now don’t tell me that you are an ex-SB and chose to go to the dark side? LOL!

  59. flyR says:

    “QUESTION. sb’s being on this site ive always wondered about undercover cops”

    I have never heard of it .


    It’s always dangerous to generalize on a limited sample size . My guess is that I you are here in a year you’ll feel different about many things .

  60. Josh says:

    I am new to the blog side of this website.

    I skimmed through old threads and comments. I just cannot believe that people have posted so many pretentious comments in the past.

    The SB/SD space is not about fake-ness. It is about brutal honesty as Brandon has suggested.

  61. KatPaw says:

    @Josh this includes my husband! lol He first hand knows what happens. Also considering I’m very picky with who’s privates I’ll be playing with.. I have no NEED for a SD and am happily married 😉 so I get to be picky.. Even more so now!

  62. Josh says:


    ANY fluid exchange is risky business. Avoid it whether you like the taste or not. LOL!

  63. KatPaw says:

    Ok have to weigh in on the oral.. Sorry Spicey but I am in no way a prude.. But I do not let men cum in my mouth let alone swallow.. ( the consistency and taste of cum makes me vomit ) so when I refuse to allow it it’s in respect for them and myself.. I do not like to vomit especially on someone else. Eeek yuck! So hell give me a facial let it dribble down my lips and chin.. Go ahead draw a picture on my tits if it pleases you but cumming in my mouth nope!

  64. Josh says:


    I really don’t understand what you write. Therefore, let’s agree to disagree and move on. LOL!

    On the more practical side, I wish you are making arrangement(s) with the type of SD(s) you are interested in, and who meet your needs and wants. Best of luck girl!!!

  65. Eloquence says:

    @ Josh

    You are more than welcome to continue to throw stones as heavy or light as you can carry. As Melissa mentioned prior “it is a free and public blog” and however you perceive to receive the information that is provided to you will undoubtedly depict your outcome for you are but a reflection: Out of your mouth comes the utterance of your heart (irregardless if you profess to carry one or not).

  66. Josh says:


    I don’t know what you are trying to say with your reference to the Beatles song.

    Love-talk and fantasies sell very well. That’s why Sir Paul McCartney is millionaire hundreds of times over, and so is Julia Roberts, to a lesser degree.

    SB/SD is the real deal. Other male-female “relationships” are mostly pretense. If love worked then this site would not be necessary, and you and I would not be here.

    Again, we are on a SD site. So offer the best from your side to him and try to get the best arrangement from him. Keep it real and don’t sneak anything in the arrangement–extra money, love, relationship, etc.–which was not discussed before-hand. That’s all I have to say. LOL!

  67. Eloquence says:

    @ Josh

    Tis a shame, then you have yet to experience any style of sugar to compare like this: Youtube “Don’t Let Me Down” – The Beatles-Acoustic Cover by Bennington.

  68. Josh says:


    If sugar is not for you then move on. If it is then stay on. I am sure sugar works for women as well as men. That’s why men pay for these sites and allowances. If it didn’t work then this site would be deserted, and Brandon would be selling something else. LOL!

    I have made my choice. I am only going to have sugar arrangements for rest of my life as long as I find female flirtation, body and vagina interesting. LOL!

    To each is own…

  69. Josh says:


    SB/SD is a mutually beneficial arrangement. As long as both are holding their end of the bargain, the arrangement will be fine. If one or the other tries to sneak things into the arrangement, which were not previously discussed then there would be problem.

    I have met really nice SBs through this site, unfortunately we could not agree on MBA.

    Many SBs are reading too many fluff pieces about SB/SD arrangements, and the articles on this website, where SDs appear to be their ATMs, that is, condos, cars, shopping, travel, spending cash, and SDs are sending them flowers.

    Snap out of it. LOL!

    My last SB continually tried to up her allowance so within 3 months, she was demanding 50% more than the originally agreed-upon amount. Not knowing the limit of her demands, I had to let her go.

    The current one sneaks expenses out of the blue but they are manageable for right now. By the way, we have had four meetings so far and we have not had sex yet. I like her a LOT and want her to be comfortable when she does whether it is on the 5th meeting or the 10th.

    She is an awesome flirt; which I am a sucker of. LOL!

    Sneaking “things” does not necessarily mean money. It could be anything, which was not discussed before. So far, none of my SBs has tried to turn our arrangement into relationship. I would consider that as sneaking something which was not discussed.

    Bottom-line: This and similar sites are about “arrangements” not “relationships.” So keep it real, and keep drama out of these arrangements.

    If an SD is an asshole, leave him and report to the site, and if he abuses you in any shape or form, then report to the authorities, and get legal assistance. What else can I say?

  70. SugarySpicey says:

    Josh – I have loved deeply and with full committment only to find that once a man “locks” a woman down with the bonds of her love he IS abusive. Not physically, but in many other ways that a person can missuse another. Men can do things I would NEVER do to a person, yet I’ve met numerous men who do it without thinking it’s a problem at all. Still I wouldn’t characterize ALL men with so ignorant a paintbrush. Nor would I be so ethnocentric as to make a claim about a population of 500,000,000 women. Really, you think not a single Chinese woman now or ever has focused on “love”. There are no Chinese love poems written by women, no Chinese love songs, no heartbroken wives who married the love of their life only to have him become selfish, lazy, and cruel?

    Ladies – Josh is a perfect example of my description of sugar: “damaged people, damaging people, in exchange for money.”

    Back to my sugar purge, Josh reminded me again of what I almost forgot, there are some very, very, very bad men on SA, who will treat you very badly.

  71. Josh says:

    @flyr: SB/SD is an “arrangement” and not a “relationship.” Fortunately for some and unfortunately for others, some of these arrangements may turn into “relationship.”

    My bet is on keeping it in the arrangement realm and not expecting too much more than the obvious mutual benefits it provides. The more SB/SD arrangements we have around, the less stigma will be attached with such arrangements.

    That said, to each is own…Freedom of choice is a good thing. That’s why they have chocolate and vanilla (and also strawberry) ice-cream. LOL!

  72. Josh says:

    @sweetie: Be a “gentleman”, skip my comments. LOL!

  73. Josh says:


    Thanks for your comments.

    I find them vague, but maybe this is not the place to have a detailed discussion. Maybe it is. LOL!

    Would you care to elaborate: “Women tend to want more from a marriage, especially emotionally, than men” and “Modern women tend to want a true partnership.”

    The bottom-line for me is that with current state of women-centric laws and expectations of men, I am done with traditional “relationships”.

    1) I am enjoying my SBs
    2) I want to keep it that way
    3) I thank Brandon to make it easy to find affordable SBs in abundance.
    4) LOL!

  74. sweetie says:

    Josh, why are you here? You have a chip on your shoulder about women, go take it somewhere else. Are you one of those bitter divorced guys? I don’t care to know about your poor me, she took half my shit. Behave like a gentleman. So far all you’ve done is spew poison!

  75. Kindred Spirit says:

    “She’s not offended nor disgusted by a penis ejaculating, she just doesn’t want it coming in her mouth. Why does it automatically make her a prude? Melissa, for the record, I don’t think you’re a prude.”

    Totally agree with Sweetie, here. We all have our preferences and non-preferences. 🙂

  76. Josh says:


    Don’t act like an escort and you will not have any problem. Don’t try to get the potential SD to pay for an expense he had nothing to do with, don’t try to get certain amount of money before you bed him, don’t try to link money with vagina in any shape or form, etc.

    A couple of months ago I met this SB on this site. She insisted that she must meet me along with her housemate. When we met, she did not look the same as her pictures. So I was not that interested in getting any arrangement going. Then she came out of the blue and said that if you pay us X amount of dollars, and take us to a hotel, we will blow your brain. I said thanks but no thanks.

    Full disclosure: Being a high-libido man, they “might” have been able to convince me to have my brain blown if they were my type. They were not, so my brain is still unblown. LOL!

    Since you are a woman you ARE going to piss your SD off often. If he is a smart and gentlemanly he will ignore those of your feminine attempts.

    However, once you are in an arrangement, don’t piss your SD off too much with frequent escalation of your demands for dollars-for-vagina. Who knows…that good ole SD might join the force and then turn against you. LOL!

  77. Kindred Spirit says:

    Tender~ my hope would be that the police are too busy patrolling and finding the escorts on the streets to be going on a site like this. That’s my hope….

    While most of us (optimistic thinking?) are not pros on this site, I can totally see where you’re coming from, Tender! Heck, that thought has crossed my mind when I’m walking downtown in the evening to meet a pot for the first time, but just try to walk tall and dismiss that thought. It’s just a shame what so many people don’t care to understand or even try to understand about what this site is about. It’s disheartening if what you worry about is ever true. Sigh….
    So, my little motto is:

    Hope for the best and screen for the worst!! 😉

  78. Richard says:

    @Josh – Your thoughts aren’t particularly thought-provoking, at least for me. They are simply naive and misogynist.

    Women initiate the vast majority of divorces. So what? Women tend to want more from a marriage, especially emotionally, than men. Not to stereotype, but often Asian women raised in a traditional home are willing to stay in a marriage that provides only her basic needs. Modern women tend to want a true partnership and aren’t satisfied with only being provided for (although these days many women are the bigger earner).

    Very rarely is it about money, since women tend to take a substantial financial hit by getting divorced (look up that statistic).

  79. Josh says:

    First of all, I commend this blog to allow me to post my unfiltered commentary on female bullshit against men in the name of freedom of expression, equality, etc.

    My posts are thought-provoking in nature…I would appreciate if you can keep it civil and non-personal, and follow this blog’s etiquette when writing your posts.

    Otherwise, I will just ignore you. Not because I cannot intellectually respond to you, but because you will intentionally drag the discussion to toilet; a typical PETA-style feminist (feminatzi?) technique. LOL!

    The reference to Chinese women was NOT about Chinese prostitutes but Chinese women in relationship. So calling those marriage-minded Chinese women “prostitutes” does not make sense. I have never dated let alone bed a Chinese woman yet. So your statistics came from someone’s ass indeed. LOL!

    My statistics above are from a divorce lawyers’ website called “Divorce Lawyer Source”. I cannot give direct link of the website because this blog apparently does not allow url posting. Search for Laura Doyle’s article “Women: Five Reasons Your Divorce Is Your Fault”. Click on the link her point number 4.

    Here is copy-paste of the relevant section from the Divorce Lawyer Source website:

    “The Same throughout the 19th Century
    A study reported in the American Law and Economics Review in 2000, “These Boots Are Made for Walking: Why Most Divorce Filers are Women” also showed that more recently, women file more than two-thirds of divorce cases in the US. Even though the individual states’ data vary somewhat and the numbers have fluctuated over time, throughout most of the 19th century about 60 percent of divorce filings were by women.

    Moreover, in some of the states where no-fault divorce was introduced, over 70 percent of the divorce filings were by women. Among college-educated couples, the percentage of divorces initiated by wives is a whopping 90 percent.”

  80. sweetie says:

    Here’s Tender’s question:

    “QUESTION. sb’s being on this site ive always wondered about undercover cops and such playing as if they’re SD’s. when talking about allowances and stuff it’s a nerve racking thought. have any sb’s had any thought, trouble, or advice about this? it would be great… thanks”

    I don’t know about SA, but it certainly isn’t a prostitution site. If it weren’t legal, it wouldn’t be up and going. I don’t think there are cops lurking around. Now if you were on craigslist, different story.
    Guys, pitch in. Have you ever had suspicions?

  81. sweetie says:

    She’s not offended nor disgusted by a penis ejaculating, she just doesn’t want it coming in her mouth. Why does it automatically make her a prude? Melissa, for the record, I don’t think you’re a prude.

  82. SugarySpicey says:

    Sweetie – the definition if prude is “one who is easily shocked or offended by things which do not shock or offend most people.” Penises ejaculate, the perpetuation of the species relies on it. So, being offended or disgusted by one if he most basic things a penis does is, by it’s very definition, prudish.

  83. SugarySpicey says:

    Josh – your ignorant bitterness is astounding! Out of who’s ass did you pull your made up statistic? I would continue on to explain that romantic love is a sociological phenomenon experienced and expressed by every culture and gender in the universe, but you are clearly a troll who won’t return and incapable of dealing with women who can read and fill their own bellies. Go back to abusing your Chinese prostitutes – 100% of whom probably believe that you are abusive in bed.

  84. sweetie says:

    I’m just tired of hearing about it, that’s all.

  85. Richard says:

    @Sweetie – I’m not sure it’s really a “trend” unless you mean awareness is increasing. It’s also not some subspecies of female…pretty much any woman is capable of it under the right circumstances. Some more easily than others. In my experience.

  86. sweetie says:

    I didn’t mean squirters. That’s a trend these days.

  87. onyx_percula says:

    @ sweetie — “A guy doesn’t get hit with a bunch of juices suddenly.” Not so fast… It really depends on the lady. I have been with ladies that barely had anything to consider “more” and on the other extreme a squirter. But I would take a stab and say about 60% of the woman I have given oral have a significant increase in juices with their orgsam. Enough that one must adjust or make a mess.

    @ Sugary — Nice to see you! I remember a tearful talk with a female friend that had just been dumped by a guy after a spit and dash to wash her mouth out… When I explained that in a manner she had just rejected him and done it in a manner that showed clearly disgust and “ewwww grosss!” that she probably hurt his feelings quite a bit.

    I guess I’m more in the camp of if you are letting him cum in your mouth swallow it, if you don’t want him cumming in your mouth then don’t let him do it. Peoples ideas change over time. I was with a girl once that on a intoxicated encounter and she got a mouth full when she never wanted one… she swallowed out of reflex… “OMG that was good! Why the hell haven’t I been doing this all along.”

  88. Richard says:

    @Sweetie and Sugary – Mmmm. Not sure where I fall on this one. I like the taste of a woman when I’m performing oral (or I wouldn’t be with her), but I have no interest in putting my mouth over her or swallowing when she squirts. I think it’s hot, but I prefer to be a spectator during the actual event. 🙂 So I can totally understand Mellisa.

    That said, I agree that perhaps a more understanding or emotionally connected man could guide her to enjoy it. It also sounds like this guy has other issues, and personally I wouldn’t want to be around someone who has that many sexual partners. YMMV.

  89. sweetie says:

    Sugary “Eventually, you’ve got to get over this silly hang up. How insulting would YOU find it if a man would go down on you, but stopped before you came because he didn’t like how wet it got you? It’s insulting and rude. That said, this guy is clearly not the guy who makes you want to explore getting over this prudish element to your bedroom behavior.”

    I don’t agree. If she doesn’t like it, then that’s off the table. I wouldn’t call it prudish nor insulting to the guy. And it can’t be compared to cunnilingus. A guy doesn’t get hit with a bunch of juices suddenly. Bedroom behavior is up to the person and should not be forced.

    If I were with a guy who kept insisting I did something I wasn’t comfortable with, I’d move the fuck on.

  90. Josh says:

    Here are my $0.02 about Traditional v. Sugar…

    “Love” between men and women is over-rated. Lust is real–whether it is casual flirtation, pronounced sexual touching or pounding in bed (or elsewhere.)

    Marriage based on “love” in the Western culture is female-serving undertaking (fraud?), as in “if you love me you will relinquish your freedom to me and then share 50% of your net-worth with me.”

    Most women cannot, do not or will not “love” men. Of course, exceptions exists.

    When a woman says to a man “I love you” it really means, “I am assuming that you are still under my control.” When/if a woman feels that her man is not under her control anymore, she bolts unleashing her hate for the MANkind on the immediate man she just dumped. Feminism provided an “intellectual” platform for these man-haters to articulate how men abuse women. 65%-90% of divorces in are filed by women. 65%-90% men are certainly not abusers.

    Chinese women are more realistic. They don’t want their men to say that they love them. They ask their men to say that they will take care of them. Makes sense. That’s what women want anyway from men. That is, to take care of them.

    Sugar relationships are honest and practical relationships. Women will do anything for a man when their bellies are empty or they are fearful of whatever or sometimes when they just want that Gucci purse.

  91. SugarySpicey says:

    Melissa – gotta weigh in here sweetie:

    As soon as you put his junk in your mouth you’re opening yourself up to oral gonorreah (which is passed to the tonsils), HIV which can brush up against sores in your mouth, and oral cancer (caused by HPV which 95% of men have coming into contact with the soft tissues of your mouth and throat which can mutate for a myriad of unknown reasons or not depending on luck and heredity). None of these risk factors increase significantly or decrease significantly with a swallow.

    I’m not sure if you’re letting him finish in your mouth and then spitting – which is just silly, childish, and insulting, or not letting him finish in your mouth at all – which I completely understand – but don’t delude yourself that it significantly reduces your STD risk.

    Eventually, you’ve got to get over this silly hang up. How insulting would YOU find it if a man would go down on you, but stopped before you came because he didn’t like how wet it got you? It’s insulting and rude. That said, this guy is clearly not the guy who makes you want to explore getting over this prudish element to your bedroom behavior.

    Deep down, when I don’t want a man to come in my mouth I might say it’s about STDs, or …. whatever, but the reality, deep down, is that I don’t really want to be anywhere near his come, because something about him triggers my emotional gag reflex. We can suppress that for sex with a condom where we get some distance from the final act, but in your mouth puts that moment literally “in your face” which just pushes you beyond your emotional boundaries.

    If you continue a sexual relationship with someone who triggers your emotional gag reflex you’ll only end up hurting yourself. In which case, is the sugar he’s giving you worth it?

  92. flyr says:

    @Richard “@Mellisa – If that one act (swallowing his cum) is singularly important to him, I’m guessing he’s not a very imaginative lover.”

    I think it’s (fixation on swallowing) more likely a power trip or even the need to make you “dirty ” in his eyes.

    Yes for many of us there’s a very special sensual pleasure in oral to completion that’s not in any way related to power etc, just pleasure. However, sugar is about relationships and relationships are about adjusting to your partner’s needs. If he’s in a relationship with you he’ll adjust. If he is “hiring ” your it’s probably his way or the highway.

    In an attempt to be the Rodney King of the bedroom (why can’t we all get along) your girlfriends can probably clue you in on some techniques that retain the feeling but send all the little critters into the air. Again not relevant if a number of us are right in the feeling that this is not the guy for you.

    Sugar should be something that’s comfortable for you now and that you will look back on in future years as something that helped you beyond the financial .

  93. Tender says:

    QUESTION. sb’s being on this site ive always wondered about undercover cops and such playing as if they’re SD’s. when talking about allowances and stuff it’s a nerve racking thought. have any sb’s had any thought, trouble, or advice about this? it would be great… thanks

  94. Richard says:

    @Mellisa – If that one act (swallowing his cum) is singularly important to him, I’m guessing he’s not a very imaginative lover. We all have things we like more than others and certain things we just aren’t comfortable with (even me…lol). You have stated your boundaries and he isn’t respecting them. If he can’t find pleasure in the myriad of other possible sexual expressions, then he’s not worth keeping. IMHO.

  95. onyx_percula says:

    Oral — Now there is a bird of a different feather! I don’t think there is another sex act that has such wide and often contradictory preferences. Past girls I have been with… One loved giving head and always swallowed, but don’t you dare think about reciprocating! Another just the other way around, no way she was giving, but received like a champ. Another that loved giving head but hated cum, so between having a man cum in her mouth versus “all over her” she chooses mouth and spits. Another that similarly hated cum but also hated the taste and would deep throat to avoid most of the taste. And the most confusing of them all… Loved giving and receiving, but always a facial then she would wipe into her mouth and swallow, WTF!

    @ Mellisa — Just tell him no. If it’s a deal breaker it’s a deal breaker, his loss.

  96. sweetie says:

    Melissa “I’m also sexually adventurous but that’s one thing that I’m not willing to try…” There’s your answer.

    • SD Guru says:

      “Should I just end it?”

      Matters in the bedroom usually come down to personal preference. But a better question is, why should you keep him?

      “I was drawn to something outside, and not fearing if my marriage may end if my wife finds out.”

      My comment about NSA applies to married SD’s who intend to stay in their marriage. If you don’t intend to stay in your marriage, I’d suggest that you get a divorce first and then go play the field as a single man. Getting emotionally attached to a SB and then going through a divorce will be way too much drama for most people to handle.

      “I wonder what drew you to Sugar life?”

      It was pretty much the same reason as yours. I wrote about this in the 7 part “Evolution of a SD” series in my blog.

  97. flyr says:

    @melissa –

    Sounds like you have a compatibility issue. My experience is that there’s usually two issues involved
    a) personal preferences
    b) the balance in the relationship

    If the partner is seeing other women then it’s both a personal preference issue and balancde issue. Plus a health issue.

    Ideally you would have some idea of preferences, expectations and boundaries before the panties hit the floor.

    Sometimes it helps to sit down witi a glass of wine and simply say – I like you but you need to understand that I find X to be uncomfortable or unacceptable.

    Unfortunately there are many men for whom receiving oral sex to completion is an act of dominance rather than shared pleasure and passion. If that’s the case it’s time to eject unless you are willing to do what is uncomfortable for you knowing that it is feeding his dominance. It’s a great lesson in understanding what’s important to you.

    Would your feeling be different if he had spent the prior half hour or so totally focused on your pleasure rather than asking for a beer and a blowjob to get him through the halftime of the game he is watching on TV? Or is it about his having “bought” you…….

    It’s a long way from sex and sugar , but Steve Pressfield (author of the legend of Bagger Vance) wrote a very short book called The Authentic Swing which discusses how the pursuit of the perfect golf swing is a mirror of finding a way to live an authentic life. It’s about letting the true you out.

  98. gtt_envy says:

    @Mellisa, I would drop him solely because he keeps pushing it or “subconsciously bringing it up” if I guy can’t see a woman is clearly not into something yet wants her to do it anyway…..SELFISH SELFISH, imo.

    I’ve met girls that say and act like they love to swallow and others are like “Hate it ewwww, yuck!” why would a guy push for the latter to do it if they find it so disgusting?

    If you are already giving him head well…….your STD risk is well you know ;( and if you don’t trust him just more reasons to run for the hills and find someone you can.

  99. Mellisa says:

    @SB’s how do you guys feel about an SD cuming in your mouth? I’ve been seeing this SD who’s into kinks. I’m also sexually adventurous but that’s one thing that I’m not willing to try ( not to sound like a prude) Lately he’s been requesting for it a lot…telling me that it’ll make him “very happy”. Is he trying to tell me something? Could this be an excuse for him to end the arrangement? I’ve also sensed that he’s the type that’s always looking for the next good thing. Like gtt_envy I have the STD paranoia, and I’m not 100% sure he’s using protection with other women. Should I just end it?

  100. flyr says:

    Purloined from an SB profile as it seems appropriate to the discussion

    ~~~~~~~~Profile officially ends here, but if you want to keep reading…~~~~~~

    My kindly-intentioned advice to men new at this site is that it helps to have a keen sense of self, know why you are here, your desires, what you are willing to give and if you are willing to abandon doubt and worries with the right lady. If you can trust your gut and once you do, you can give a genuine girl the benefit of the doubt and have a marvelous time, with no regrets.

    Knowing all this ahead of time makes you more receptive and confident going in. Keep your mind and the NSA part of your heart open. You’ll figure out fairly quickly if this site is for you or not. You’ll also learn very quickly how vital it is to screen, screen and screen some more through the fakes, the desperate and the selfish people out there. Don’t get discouraged and don’t ever “settle”. 🙂

    Choose to feel good about making a special person’s life a little easier and/or more exciting, as different as “arrangement-dating” may feel. I know I do!”””””


  101. Elaine says:

    @ flyr,

    Right! 🙂

    I think this is something both, potential SD and SB, should realize very well when they decide to enter the sugarbowl.
    Sugar can be bittersweet!

    I think that, of all usefull topics publiced about entering the sugar lifestyle, this is one of the most important conversations so far.

    Because it is not about such things as how much one should “charge” for Skype conversations, or how much the SB needs to “invest” in hairdresser, pedi, mani etc.
    Not even how much to “expect” for a first meeting.
    How much you would be “entitled” to for your stunning presence, or the time “invested” in tot. visits.
    Or what to to if you don’t find your SD attractive and you hate to have sex with him. (FREE! tip; then just don’t!)

    Does this sound ironic?
    Well,… it is!! 🙂
    But these discussions do return regularly here on the blog. (and I think my opinion on them is known)

    No! Now we are talking feelings and emotions, and THAT is the real tricky part that can leave you bitter!

    I wonder how many newbies do realise that here it is where the real danger is hiding it’s ugly face.

    Don’t consider this to be a childs play, or only some easy way to make money.
    People can get hurt and damaged!

  102. flyr says:

    Elaine “But hey! “A ship is safe in the harbour but it is not what ships are made for!””

    O Lord the sea is so vast and my shop so small – holds true in the sugar bowl

  103. Newbie Needs Help says:

    Hi everyone!!! I have been radio silent for a while, been working (yes working!) lots of hours. I don’t have much to say about my life, just wanted to say a quick hi 🙂 Will report back when I get some much needed sleep. 🙂

  104. Euphoria retired sb says:

    @ SD-Rob: 11 years. My former sd turned boyfriend is now about 12 years. We actually have plans to get married within the next year. Both are the most amazing people I’ve ever met in my life. I’m so lucky to have found them.

  105. Jersey Darling says:

    @Euphoria – To me, what you described is exactly where the emotional barrier comes into play. I’m always emotionally attached to and care for any guy I’m with. But, many times I might fantasize about more – like a life partner – and knowing there is a boundary keeps those fantasies in check. Any relationship eventually runs its course, but depending on the constraints on an arrangement (and in my experience there always are some, as I’ll outline below) that, by default, creates boundaries.

    @Rob – If the SD is not married it paints a very different picture. Ideally the discussion is had up front regarding why they are pursuing a sugar arrangement instead of a traditional relationship. For some it’s because they don’t have time, others don’t want the emotional commitment, and some guys do it because they genuinely like supporting a woman and watching her succeed. That is where the boundary would come into place – if they don’t have time for example, I’m probably not going to feel free to contact them whenever I’d like. And eventually I might want someone that I can feel free to *fully* be myself with, including contacting them whenever I’d like. But some people who are looking for an arrangement are also open to more, and those are the sorts of arrangements I prefer.

  106. SD-Rob says:

    @ onyx- quite an introduction to sugar life!
    @ euphoria- that is amazing. May I ask what the age difference is?
    @ euphoria- in my experience in sugar life, the time to develop feelings to then move on to sex on the SB side has been within the first meeting, second at the latest which continuously blew my mind!! Since I came into this prepared to court them for as many dates as it took. Even my current one that we have a nice connection now was all over me and vie versa after one quick first meeting and then a nice dinner the second date! We texted a bit in between (sextet as well) but I certainly expected more effort on my part. Sounds like in your case it took longer then ?

  107. onyx_percula says:

    @ SD-Rob — So about three months after meeting my first SB, I had spent the night at her apartment. I was in the shower and did not hear the door and walked out of the bathroom in the nude with her mother standing there mouth hanging on the floor eyes wide… Of course she freaked out. It was major drama but ended well. Yep the little side trip to surprise her little girl sure was a surprise alright, LMAO!

    Now before her little mother shocker, she told her sister. The sister freaked out and literally got on the next flight to “save her from the old pervert exploiting her!”. It took a couple of days but her sister left promising to keep her secret and actually liking me and thanking me for what I had done for her little sis.

    Her sister was key in getting mom calmed down and relational. Mom stayed a couple of extra days and just like her sister left liking and thanking me. So there was no more secret after mom found out, soon the whole family knew about it.

    So there was no hiding it from her BF and she was very up front about it. She never really used or like the whole “sugar” term. She always referred to me as BF. He put it together pretty quick though. He was upset and her family jumped him over hurting her and making her feel bad about it. He came around and now I almost always talk with him when I talk with her (separately of course).

    The only member of her family that isn’t friendly is her father, I came to find out right at the end of things didn’t hate my guts for taking his little girls virginity and all that, but because he wasn’t able to help her financially enough that she never would have needed my help. We are on “head nod” terms. Who knows he might be better at the wedding. She keeps “threatening” him if he doesn’t be nice to me she is going to have me give her away instead of him… poor guy!

  108. Euphoria retired sb says:

    @ Jersey Darling- I really don’t think that emotional barriers play a role in every sugar relationship. I know for a fact that I would never have sex with someone that I just didn’t have feelings for. I have actually had strong emotional connections to all of my former sd’s. I think its more of a matter of being civil and knowing when the relationship has run its course. After it has run it’s course, there is just no point in manipulating the other person into staying, so just accept it and move on.

  109. Euphoria retired sb says:

    SD-Rob: Yes, I married one of my sd’s he was just that amazing!

  110. SD-Rob says:

    @SD-Guru- I wonder what drew you to Sugar life? For me it was simple, lack of attention, companionship, compassion, and physical interaction. It has been like this for years, since our first was born and the second by accident.
    Love for both of the kids, making sure they had a dad with them while they were growing up was the reason I toughed it out giving no reason to my spouse to end it since I did not want to end it. But now with the kids in high school , hitting 50 and still feeling and looking better than I did in my mid 30’s I was drawn to something outside, and not fearing if my marriage may end if my wife finds out. My kids even mutter about us getting a divorce. Makes me wonder if they are smarter than I am.
    Why are you in a marriage you cannot get out? Or are you dabbling on the side like Redpaint’s SD but still happy at home? If I had been happy at home at all, I would never consider this, and I have been traveling and on road almost every week for the last 10 years.

  111. redpaint says:

    @ Rob funny how I never thought about that question! It would really never happen but to answer it, I guess we would be living together and doing all sorts of travel (finally not him on a biz trip) its so nice to just think about it but damn it society. And well, circumstances! Different for your case as I know she’s in her 30s?

  112. SD-Rob says:

    @euphoria – so you married one of your SDs?!

    @ jersey- what if your SD was not married ? Btw, I really do not spend much time with my wife, we are just in the same house with kids as our only topic to discuss. I d know that my being married is on my SB’s mind and she has even told me I have to sort it out and I know she is right.
    Interesting in terms of the $ as a reminder to keep your emotions in check. I do the same in a way.
    @ redpaint- what if your SD left his wife?

    @onyx- how did your first SB explain you to her fiancé ? As a boyfriend I would guess not a SD ?

  113. redpaint says:

    @ Rob I wouldn’t say he’s very unhappy in his marriage. He has shown or shared with me videos of his family during the festive period and he was smiling at it too when he showed me. He dated his wife for 11 years before marrying her and maybe it’s also true that responsibilities tie him down… Kid is 8 years old. They do quarrel and it always comes down to his infidelity in which he confessed some 10 years ago. He used to go to escorts very often in the past and was just used to paying for sex, he told me. In fact one of his previous sb which lasted a year was an escort-turned-sb.

  114. SD-Rob says:

    @redpaint – Elaine
    I’m in the same situation as you guys but as a SD or getting there in only about 2 months. I’m sure my SB is in about the same situation. So much we share together beyond the intimcay. Planning lots of fun things to do and excited about it. The emotional part is hard to divorce from in a satisfying sugar relationship. NSA is a great concept but as my first SB told me, there are always strings attached no matter how much you try.
    Redpaint how happily married is your SD ?

  115. redpaint says:

    @ Elaine so glad to be knowing that I am not alone in this and I do share the exact same sentiments with you regarding your reply to Jersey… and just a thought on whether it would be enriching or damaging… Well I guess there will be a time for hurting but at the end of it all… we all have something to gain.

    @ Onxy and Darkhorse thank you so much for the words and Darkhorse you really put it across well. My SD and I are definitely communicating on this and will make the best of our relationship while it lasts

  116. Elaine says:

    @ flyr

    You are soooo right with this!

    Use the revenue to create yourself a better “post-sugar” life.
    Invest in yourself, and never rely on a SD (or any man) to take care of you.

    Every women should be able to take care of herself.
    If not now, be at least prepared for the future.

    Because even if you feel safe in your relationship (or marriage) you’ll never know what the future will bring…

    At the end it is only yourself you can fully rely on…

  117. flyr says:

    appendage to JD’s list

    6) don’t commit to a sugar dependent standard of living unless you truly know it’s long term or your are willing and able to drop back to sugar free living.

  118. Elaine says:

    @ Jersey,

    Strange thing is; I can fully enjoy a one night stand for sex only.
    No problems whatsoever.
    If motivated only by money it would still be simple to coop with the NSA arrangement.

    It is only getting complicated at the moment you start sharing most of the things you normally share with someone IRL relationships.
    And my “arrangements” have always been of these nature, only difference the being “kept” part.

    But hey! “A ship is safe in the harbour but it is not what ships are made for!”

    So I have accepted the pain at the end and moved on, not always sure though if the experienced had been enriching or damaging.

    Thinking of the wise words of SS in her last post….

  119. Zack says:

    At the risk of possibly contravening protocols for nuclear SB/SD concerns…

    How do long term SD’s raise children from a current or prior married or “committed” relationship?

  120. sweetie says:

    Horsey, that’s the nicest post you’ve had so far. Guys, it’s refreshing to hear about your emotional involvement in these relationships. Good for you!

    “You are all so much better people for your emotional attachments. Don’t give that up to save the pain of the end. Be the wonderful ones you are and go on to another beautiful relationship.”

  121. Jersey Darling says:

    I also think it’s important to note that arrangements are not for everyone. Some people can’t construct the emotional barriers that are needed and aren’t good at compartmentalizing. If you are like that, this may not be for you.

    Good questions for women to ask themselves:
    1) When you’ve had one night stands, were you able to enjoy them for what they were and not expect more out of them? Did you feel hurt or used after?
    2) Are you able to step back from an argument in a relationship, put your emotions aside and examine it logically?
    3) Do you clearly know your purpose for an arrangement and what you hope to get out of it?
    4) Are you motivated purely by money? If so, are the possible emotional consequences of this worth it to you?
    5) Just how far are you willing to go with an SD? Define this regardless of how much money is involved, and then stick to your limits and don’t let money sway you to do something you might not normally be comfortable with.

  122. DarkHorseSD says:

    You are all so much better people for your emotional attachments. Don’t give that up to save the pain of the end. Be the wonderful ones you are and go on to another beautiful relationship.

  123. onyx_percula says:

    @ redpaint & Elaine — It’s okay girls. If you didn’t get attached in such an intimate relationship there would be more wrong with you than right. Revel in the moment and prepare for the future. Enjoy what you have, every second of it!

    Yes men have as many if not more problems than women with such things. I fell for my first SB and we still love each other. But we are rational intelligent people, our lives and goals/dreams just didn’t work. She found a great guy that spoils her more than I did (not sure that’s a good thing or not), they are in love and will be married this June.

    IME I have to have some connection and attraction. Which means at some level I’m going to get attached to my girls. With a few exceptions I’m on friendly terms with my past SBs, hell I still communicate with a couple of pot SBs that never worked out.

    There is no easy answer. Each situation is going to be different. Some will need emotional “touches” after its over, others will never want to see you again because it will hurt too much. But it’s important to talk about such things if that’s the road you are on. Remember an arrangement is supposed to be open, honest and easy, so COMMUNICATE!

    The pot SB that is coming to see me in a couple of weeks… if she moves in with me, we will end up falling for each. I asked her… “What are you going to do if you fall for me?” being the smart girl she is “Well what are you going to do when you fall for me?”. I think we have the answers for us and maybe others too… My answer is simple “My priority is your happiness and wellbeing. I will act accordingly.” Her answer was… “Then I will fall for you. Things will change over time. I want you to be happy and I want to be happy. So we will do what is best for both of us.”. Of course easily said now…

  124. Elaine says:

    @ redpaint

    Completely understand you.
    Am actually in a same sort of situation.

    Can anybody please explain how to do this;
    not getting emotionally attached to someone you talk to so often and intensely, share intimate thoughts, spend a lot of time together, have sex , sleep in each others arms etc. !?

    Probably much easier if you don’t find him attractive, or see this only as a financial transaction.
    But the paradox ; I could never be with someone whit whom I don’t connect, or that I am not attracted to.

    It’s all so much easier said than done….NSA,…. it’s a thin rope to balance.

    Don’t know, maybe men are better in it… (sigh)
    Or maybe I am indeed old fashioned.

  125. redpaint says:

    What nine months can do to my heart… In just nine months I opened up myself, let him in with all my stories, even those that I hold so dear to my heart, and learnt a great deal about him too. From a stranger I thought I couldn’t trust to a man I bare my heart and soul. I know we still have a long way to go with an inevitable end (sigh) but he makes me want to make our days count. So bittersweet for me… He is married with a kid and we are 21 years apart. He knows his place and what he can’t be for me so he told me if I am ready to move on, just let him know and he will sort out his old heart himself…

    • SD Guru says:


      I’ve read your posts over the past few days and I understand your dilemma. We’re in a similar situation as married SD’s who intend to stay in their marriage, and I don’t think our situation is that uncommon. Over the years I’ve learned one of my golden rules: don’t get emotionally attached and keep it NSA. To do otherwise as a married SD can lead you down a slippery slope that you may not be able to get out of.

      The hardest part is to figure out what is the “exit strategy” or “end game” for a married SD. I’ve often pondered that question but after ten years in the sugar world and many long term SB’s I still don’t have a clear answer.

  126. Jersey Darling says:

    @Rob – Regarding those boundaries, let’s take you, for example. If I were in an arrangement with you (and this generally applies for me with all married men), no matter how good the arrangement is or how strongly I might feel for you, I would always have a boundary up within myself because I’d know it could never be more – you are married. Eventually, if someone comes along that can fill that void and wants a true, long term relationship with me, he is providing everything you cannot. He’s filled the void within that boundary, and you can see why the arrangement would end.

    And can you guess how that would start? Probably as an emotional affair on the arrangement relationship. The girl would start getting to know this guy, and eventually, if that is what she wants, pursue things with him. You can spend most waking moments of the day with a sugar baby and this can happen. Just like you spend a lot of time with your wife but have managed to make time for another woman.

    Now I for one am all about emotional involvement. I can’t be with a guy (including in an arrangement) where I don’t genuinely care about him or like his company. For me, the financial remuneration is a reminder that hey – there is a boundary here – don’t get too attached.

    In fact, with one of my favorite pot SDs, I would have happily been with him without an arrangement, but I *had* to insist on one so that I wouldn’t get too attached. Otherwise, I would have demanded more from him emotionally.

  127. Euphoria retired sb says:

    @ SD-Rob: Which one? The one that drunk dialed me? The one that went psyco? The one I married? The one I moved 2000 miles away from? The one that took me on great vacations? Hmmmm…. All for different reasons. I guess all that matters is that I am in a amazing committed relationship now, and that makes me happy.

  128. onyx_percula says:

    @ gtt_envy — ” I forget which blog member said it, but it went something like this “I like younger women!” and that’s me” (Raises hand…)

    I have ALWAYS liked younger women. Which made it tough till younger was always legal. I think if I showed up with a woman my age and it was clear we weren’t just friends all of my friends and family would faint from shock. lol

    On topic — I posted about it before, but my first and I would likely be together if it weren’t for the age gap and her desire to have a family. If she never wanted kids, we would still be together.

    With the age differences its tough to go from a arrangement to a GF/BF H/W relationship. The smaller the gap the easier it will be more times than not.

    So lets take a not too uncommon age matchup in sugar… She is 20 and he is 50. 30 years difference for the math impaired 😉 So let’s assume that the SD comes from good genetic stock, keeps in good health and lives a moderate lifestyle aka no world record attempts in their life… He is going to be dead and gone in ~30 years.

    Rather we like it or not (I don’t) women in their 40’s, 50’s and 60’s simply have a harder time finding a second mate, a career. If she hasn’t really worked (do women do that anymore?) entering at those ages is going to be super hard.

    You can nip problems in the bud by planning for her life after your death. Make sure she has enough to live off the interest till her time, let her have a SB or three.

    Kids are tougher… So you are planning to attend your first’s HS graduation and you’re 70… and the last won’t be there for another 5 years. Oh and 4+ years of college, oh and the inevitable “they are my kids and I don’t care how old they are they need help!”. Are you going to give away your little girl from a wheelchair at 80? And so and so on.

    Make that 30 with 50 and many of those issues are at least reduced. Make it 35 and 45 and its called match.com not SA, lol.

  129. blondie says:

    I wish these posts had a ‘like’ button lol and I really wish this website had a proper forum for members to discuss the lifestyle under proper headings. Maybe I will email Brandon Wade!

  130. SD-Rob says:

    @ Euphoria – curious why you broke up with your SD in the first place ?

    @ GTT- yes exactly. So does your LTR partner know you are also doing sugar ? I figure she is older given your desire for young 20 somethings ? I see your sugar as something extra and nice on the side. For me it is the escape from nothing to something, and given how good it is it draws me too far in I fear.

  131. Mellisa says:

    Thank God we are all are different for what a bore life would be.I’f we were all the same and then you wouldnt be here. It matters not if you can perceive what I say since you were not addressed. On a lighter note….I have better to do than read of someone else in circles.

    @Eloquence- not sure if you read some of my previous posts from few weeks ago but I self deprecated my poor English (since it’s my third language) which will obviously mean my intentions were not bad and no pun was intended….and as far as the “in circles” go I thought this was a public blog?? On a lighter note…..my apologise if you took it the wrong way:-)

  132. Euphoria retired sb says:

    I love the fact that me and my ex sd are so close that he can drunk dial me at 2am and just ramble about anything and everything. Last night he was drunk and called telling me all of his sugar stories until he appeared to pass out drunk. It was such a fun conversation. The honesty and connections on here are like nothing I’ve ever had in my life.

  133. gtt_envy says:

    @SD-Rob, you really don’t seem happily married at all. I’m in a LTR, so no not single, but Sugar feels a deep desire. I forget which blog member said it, but it went something like this “I like younger women!” and that’s me. I’m happy in my LTR Sugar just provides that extra kick.

    I enjoy the beauty and all that a early 20 something has going for her in that department. I like the first time experience in travel, fine dining, the thank you’s etc and her huge smile when those first time experiences happen.

    I don’t want to feel like a number though, nor do I want to be lied to or juggled with other SD’s. I can actually handle her having a boyfriend though my STD paranoia rises to the top from time to time. I recently tried having two and it is hard for me………and now it’s back down to 1 and it feels so much better!

    What you seem to seek from your posts is a whole new relationship lol. I’m assuming divorce is no option for you for a multitude of reasons. I’m just looking for a sincere connection, lots of chit chat, and special moments 2-3 times a month.

    You on the other hand have quite the conundrum ;(

  134. SD-Rob says:

    @ gtt- well I’m trying to figure out what it is that I want. Exclusive is great but you get entangled and if you think it won’t last then that is always tha in back of your mind.
    Other for me is if she is indeed exclusive too,, or somehow is able to show such emotions , discuss details of her life, and share very raw intimate moments to two (or more) with no signs of having two and doubling her sugar all the while.
    With these you start doubting the value of what may be an ideal situation that may even lead to more, and you decide to let it dissolve.
    But then what ? Onto multiple SBs ? Or another exclusive one with possibly the same issues and ending? Or out of sugar altogether ?
    I believe you are single so options are more for you in terms of outside of sugar. That might make it easier …?

  135. gtt_envy says:

    @SD-Rob, you know the answer to having several versus 1 that you are into more….it won’t work for people like you or me. A hop in the sack and see ya later or txt ya in a couple days does nothing for me. I’d rather see a escort and would see a escort if that is what I wanted.

    For many SD’s this is perfect because they really just want a romp in the sack with someone 20-40 years their junior I want much more than just that and going by your posts you do too.

  136. SD-Rob says:

    @ jersey – would to hear you expand on the boundaries you mention and in particular what you mean by filling in the gaps. I for example see a case where the sugar meetings are infrequent enough in an arrangement where one gravitates towards another SB (or SD) or someone outside of sugar. But what if the frequency is rather high, for example currently with my current one, it is at least once mostly twice and she wants to move to twice regularly.
    But they are not say over weekends where both of us may go out and find something outside sugar. We have decided not to do that, although for me being married is almost next to impossible while for her much easier. Though lingers in my mind about that all the time but there needs to be some level of trust , but as my investment into this grows (time and emotion concern me more than money , which is however substantial ), the more I get concerned about whether this is the right approach , as opposed to having several, less emotional involvement.
    @ Zack – could not agree more that without communication between the parties between meetings it really sucks and feels very transactional. Also not really getting know more of each others lives. But as you say some actually prefer it that way and I quickly dropped such SBs,but other SDs may find that just the right thing

  137. flyr says:


    How does one get past administering “tests” rather than communicating expectations? I think most of the SD’s here do that a lot.
    I think budgets help–stay within one and it’s easier to maintain equanimity and perspective. Get “used” and things get critical fast.”

    It’s not an issue of administering a test for the test’s sake but rather an opportunity to solve an SB’s crisis knowing that both outcomes have some value. I would prefer that she not have a financial crisis, but if it is here you have to deal with it. I have also told SB’s that their request was not something I felt comfortable with.

    One of the reasons for an SB to have an SD is to have someone with wisdom and the ability to slay the occasional dragon whether it be with a little cash, a patient ear, wisdom or a stern talk with her slumlord or other commercial bully.

    It doesn’t always work out as intended. I lost one of the best whom I met during her financial crisis days. Sex was her release from the stress of dealing with creditors. And there was limitless stress. I walked her through the analysis showing that BK was her only way out but that she would almost certainly keep her house with a manageable debt. Got her the NOLO books, read them to her between sex .

    When she finished BK her sex drive dropped 80% and she was suddenly wanting to find a father for her to be made baby. Totally understandable and I felt good – other than the times I was missing

  138. sweetie says:

    I’m not sweating it. I put my share of effort in the inquiries I get based on the effort the man has invested. I’m on the same page with Onyx’ lady, say clearly what you want, and I’ll see if it fits the puzzle.

    Thanks all for the feedback. I don’t like to beat around the bush. We each have different methods.

    Regarding writing essays, oh, how I dread those things! I feel it’s a curse to have to do the thesis/argument crap and the inept repetition of what’s been said before in your body paragraph. You’d think we’d passed English 101.

  139. Zack says:


    How does one get past administering “tests” rather than communicating expectations? I think most of the SD’s here do that a lot.
    I think budgets help–stay within one and it’s easier to maintain equanimity and perspective. Get “used” and things get critical fast.

    I think options also help. Not everyone who “Clicks” initially has compatible secondary and tertiary goals….or even understands what they are.

    btw…so just cutting to cash per meet without conversation channels one into a transnational relationship…which many seem to prefer. Shrug.


  140. KatPaw says:

    Hello “former” Jersey Darling! Missed you glad to see you back!

    Meow and purrrr to the rest! I’m feeling more positive then I have in some time!!

  141. gtt_envy says:

    Tough one truly a tough one!

    I enjoy both 😉 which at times can weigh on me a bit since morals get in the way. I identify with SD-Rob and Onyx that my sugar relationships are far more like real relationships and ending them is hard, but they can’t be eternal either. Someone always wants too much or ends up investing too little at some point, or it starts to feel transactional, or regrettably you get sorta bored.

    Best of luck to all!

  142. Gentle(man)soul says:

    Topic : IRL vs Sugar style

    The two are not mutually exclusive .
    BUT ,what draws me to Sugar World is the availability of girls up to 40 yrs my junior . IRL it would not ever happen .

    Here in Sugarville we develop a relationship in which a younger girl can appreciate her man as a true love and not just a payday over time ,and actually consider him as a life partner . See DarkH’s discussion about his long term love .

    I also like the absence of pretense as a SD . We both know what the other needs right away and usually there are no games . Things move forward more quickly

  143. Jersey Darling says:

    @Rob, it was the worst! But it was also the best – learning to appease someone and tailor your style to your audience is an important skill, regardless of whether you agree with the foundation of a person’s opinions.

    Like you Rob I prefer exclusivity in my arrangements. But there are reasons why one chooses sugar (typically, for the boundaries) and it is those exact boundaries that may lead one to end up with someone else if that person can fill in the gaps those boundaries leave.

    For myself, I’d be open to the possibility of life beyond an arrangement for the person I’d be in an arrangement with – circumstances permitting. But I suspect that is a rare option.

  144. SD-Rob says:

    @ Sweetie- I beg to defer with Richard. I think you did the right thing bringing up the allowance. I found that easy to deal with. It could be that your request was too high. If that happened to me though, I would always write back and humbly say that it was too much. Many times they came back with a counter (sometimes I countered).

  145. SD-Rob says:

    @ jersey- don’t you hate those profs who suck all the life out of you in a particular topic? Subjects like writing that are judged subjectively are the worst for that.

  146. SD-Rob says:

    @Eloq – interesting your comment about my current SB as potential second wife the way things are going (a comment i did fully understand, lol) and then this new blog topic.
    I find myself conflicted in this area. Unlike Flyr while I’m with this SB we have agreed to be exclusive and given the time and energy and emotion I am investing in it, not to mention $$$$, I do not really feel like I can say that it would be wonderful if she met someone in a normal relationship (I hate the term IRL, since sugar is quite real).
    But In terms of her becoming a second wife, not worrying about all the complications of getting out of the first, her plans are finish grad school and find a job she likes that may take her across the country or even to Europe. So, hence the conflicting in all this. Of course, it is all too early and I’m enjoying what I am investing in this but depending how the next few months go it may go a different direction and end.
    This is why I wondered how long The bloggers’ sugar relationships have lasted since it is hard for me to imagine a real LTR in this area without someone getting hurt, unless they each have a stable other relationship (for example a solid marriage where the SD is playing on the side- i dont condone that btw) or plans on the SB side who is using this as an bridge to the next chapter in her life.

  147. Jersey Darling says:

    @flyr, You are just a gem 🙂

  148. Euphoria retired sb says:

    There’s always room for cake. I always am watching my sb figure, so I just get the raw vegan chocolate cake! Yeah!

  149. Jersey Darling says:

    @Eloquence, I used to have an ornate writing style. My favorite authors were from the late 1800s and early 1900s, when it was still common to write passages in French. As a result, my writing used to be peppered with lavish words and difficult sentence structures.

    My teachers always loved my writing, but when I got to college, I had a teacher that beat it out of me. She’d tear apart my essays sentence by sentence if she had to, stressing that I should write more simply.

    I loathed her at the time for it, but in retrospect she had a point. The point of communicating is to communicate, and if what you write is perceived as convoluted to the point that other’s can’t understand it, your communication is lost.

  150. Eloquence says:

    @ Melissa

    Thank God we are all are different for what a bore life would be.I’f we were all the same and then you wouldnt be here. It matters not if you can perceive what I say since you were not addressed. On a lighter note….I have better to do than read of someone else in circles. 🙂

  151. Mellisa says:

    @ Sweetie- from the previous blog. I always say there’s someone out there for everyone. It’s great that you know what you want in an arrangement and have the patients. This whole process sometimes gets too confusing for me ( bear in my mind that I rarely get confused:-) so more power to anyone who can swim through without getting lost somewhere in the middle.

    @ SD Rob- For a moment I was beginning to think I was the only one who didn’t get Eloquence:-)

    @Zaki, thanks for the warm welcome, I’m fairly new in posting but I’ve been following the blog for quite a while now.

    @All- I don’t know about you guys but I miss SS:( I enjoyed reading her posts. I’m the kind of a person who craves a difference of opinion ( when it’s stated in a healthy way).

    @ SS- if you come back I’ll make a deal with you….I’ll let you be my grammar police for 6 months:-)

    I hope everyone is keeping warm,except flyer and JJ-;) you’re warm enough wherever you are.

  152. flyR says:

    @ Jersey IRL vs S Bowl – I’ve usually had the IRL chat with SB’s along the lines of” should you find someone you really like IRL while we are in a sugar relationship I’ll be thrilled for you.. If you were not special I would not have pursued you” .

  153. sweetie says:

    Jersey “I wish I being a lifelong academic student was a career choice.” I agree with that. However, I prefer being part-time student in general. Right now I can’t wait for school to be over.

  154. Jersey Darling says:

    Re: Blog topic, you should absolutely eat the cake. Unless you’re watching your SB figure.

    I’m on the fence about sugar vs traditional. Having just moved somewhere new, I have a hunch I’m going to meet a lifelong partner here, and for the first time in a long time something clicked where I am now ready to settle down. In the meantime though, I think a SB/SD arrangement wouldn’t be a bad idea with the right person – plus, you never know where prince charming will be.

  155. Jersey Darling says:

    @flyr How ironic, your virgin comment is this blog’s first 😉

    @sweetie From the previous blog… I won’t disclose exact location but yes I’m in MA 🙂 Classes are great, honestly easier than I expected so far *knock on wood* but we’ll see how it turns out as the semester progresses. I’m absolutely loving being back in school! I wish I being a lifelong academic student was a career choice.

  156. flyr says:

    Entering a sugar relationship is like building a building with only what plans you choose to use, no government approvals, materials of your choice from brick to paper and rooms of all sizes and descriptions. Some will build homes with two back doors.

    It may not survive the first storm or survive for eternity –

  157. flyr says:

    Yikes A virgin blog….