6 years ago
Lessons From Famous Sugar Babies
  • Posted May 28, 2014


Sugar Babies are a highly stigmatized phenomena. The fact is, many women in the public eye are proudly leading lives of sugar. Here are some noteworthy celebs that directly inspire the modern Sugar Baby.   The Internet and social media assist us in following these fascinating arrangements, but proceed slowly – notable babies provide cautionary tales to happiness.

Kim Zolciak

The infamous “Real Housewife of Atlanta” turned heads with pulled wigs and an alleged affair to real-estate developer Lee Najjar.  Portions of the relationship were captured by BravoTV film crew.  Najjar provided Zolciak with more than an Escalade, he got down on one knee for the wigged-princess.  Unfortunately things did not work out between Zolciak and Najjar, but their relationship provided Zolciak a storyline for the launch of her housewifes career.  Zolciak is now married to Kroy Biermann and stars in a show of her own “Don’t Be Tardy,” proving that a Sugar Baby must take chances to get what they want.

The Girls Next Door

Hugh Heffner is the original Sugar Daddy, providing hundreds of Sugar Babies a happy home in the heart of Beverly Hills.  Prominent playmates include Holly Madison, Kendra Wilkinson, and Crystal Harris from the E! series “The Girls Next Door.”  Although Holly diligently campaigned for the role of wife in Hugh’s life, it was Season 6 alum, Crystal Harris, who engaged, ran away, re-engaged, and eventually wed the playboy himself.  The road to Sugar was paved with centerfolds and bunny ears, going to show – do everything on your terms.

Anna Nicole Smith

As the most infamous Sugar Baby of all time, Anna Nicole holds a place in my heart as a fabulously bad bitch. Anna worked at a strip-club in Texas until she came across oil-tycoon J. Howard Marshall, who was 62 years her senior.  While their relationship was solidified by marriage, Anna did not secure assets through a written agreement prior to J.Howard’s passing.  Anna Nicole passed away in 2007 with the impression that she would never be rewarded from the Marshall estate.  In May 2013 the estate of Anna Nicole Smith was granted a rumored 49 million, which will go directly to Anna’s daughter, Danielynn.

Kevin Federline

Yes, men can be Sugar Babies too.  In 2004, Britney Spears dropped her world tour and management staff for a mysterious man from Fresno, California.  The pair eloped with a non-traditional ceremony in Studio City, California.  Although the infamous duo was married for just two years, Kevin came out on top – he obtained custody of the children, which grants him over $300,000 in child support annually.

Mariah Carey

This sugar-baby often goes without recognition.  The elusive chanteuse was married to record-executive Tommy Mattola at the launch of her career.  MC and Mattola eventually split, but Mariah’s career  experienced phenomenal success as the divorce unfolded.  Mariah was smart to maintain her own career, rather than live Mattola’s life.  Mariah has since gone from Sugar Baby to cougar with her marriage to much younger Nick Cannon.

V Stiviano

V Stiviano has made recent headlines through her notorious relationship with LA Clippers owner, Donald Sterling.  Sterling had attempted to cut Stiviano off, while his wife asked that she return all gifts Sterling provided over their lengthy relationship.  Stiviano retaliated by leaking racist-recordings of Sterling.  The tarnish in this arrangement is sad to see – mentioned parties should maintain a mutual respect towards the arrangement.

Gallery of Famous Sugar Babies

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What advice would you give a Sugar Baby?

Leave a Reply

829 Responses to “Lessons From Famous Sugar Babies”

  1. Anonymous says:

    i have yet to find a sugga momma 🙁

  2. Lexi says:

    Please email me- I have a question about being a sugar baby that I would like to keep private (:

  3. katarina says:

    I want to know why after posting the ages of the men{older} 40-60 and men only, the only people I am finding on this sight are either gay or looking for either men or women. I have yet to see sugar babies in their 20s instead of sugar daddies

  4. I’m seeking a generous SD/SM, but I want someone I can be companions with, laugh with, turn to for advice, and be a true friend to as well as exploring with in an intimate way. But I am a lady and don’t mind waiting for the right one. I have however, been having a hard time finding the sugar my heart longs for. Any suggestions, tips, or advice?

  5. Anonymous says:

    Sugar Daddy will become Bitter Daddy while Sugar Baby will be Digger Baby,,,

  6. Steve says:

    There are getting to be more and more “SBs” signing on who specify no sexual contact. I wish there was a filter by which you could exclude these from searches and not waste people’s time by clicking on their profile. To me these girls are just here to take advantage of vulnerable men, wanting cash to merely talk or allowing them the “privilege” of buying them dinner!

    • john says:

      I chat with one girl,she only allowed “hug,and kiss in cheek”,lol…

    • AlexP says:

      This site is called Seeking Arrangement. If that is the arrangement they seek and some one agrees to that arrangement, there is no problem.

    • Tyrone says:

      The No sex thing gets me. But to each his own I guess. I just don’t get spending valuable time and money on a wonderful SB and all you get is a hand shake and “Thank You” Maybe the first couple of dates, but if I’m taking you to Europe or Asia countries for business/pleasure trips I personally will be expecting a little more than a hand shake. Of course that is just me. Maybe that’s why I’m picky and have not found the right SB for me.

  7. Marie Annettea says:

    Everything is so different now on this site when i first signed up 7 years ago i met a great man mid 40s and had a long relationship with him.it was a great SB-SD experience. We went to dinners and lunches, partys or just private getways. We had set dates and always worked fantastic i got a monthly allowance and new experiences and he got the company he wanted,fun and the girlfriend feel with out the strings..just an understanding. Its was two way agreement we were both happy.

    So i decided to give it another try and i came back. Now all most every msg i get are msg from men who want nothing more then casual adult fun(meaning sex) 2-4times a month payment per meet (not only does that make me feel like they’re calling me a prostitute but apparently a cheap on) oo and then there are men on here who want sex but do not woth to give the women anythin but what they say is a fun night (speaking from a young pretty sb i didnt come here just to have sex with random older men just for fun i can very well get that on my own) nor did i come to sell my ass like a common escort.

    The site use to be for SDs to meet SBs not men looking for one nighters.what happend to mutual benefits..what happened to the Men who liked the company of younger pretty girls to wine & dine and of course have a intimate connection with in exchange for taking care of and or spoiling his Babe. Does the traditional SD-SB relationship not exist anymore?

    • charlotte says:

      I know right…?!! I only get contacted by older guys hinting they want sex… for the price of a dinner meal. Not only do they assume I am an escort, but think I am a cheap one too! If I want cheap sex, I would go down to a nightclub and get myself a young hottie. Seriously, I am disappointed.

    • PrinceDaniel says:

      this site seems dead. sex has become too attainable with all the apps – nobody cares about this headache anymore, I guess…

    • Michael says:

      Management is taking the ???? and is not filtering out the “users “ hey here for the weekend with a date next 3 days… ppm. !!! allowances come on this is meant to be trustworthy and a arrangement site
      Time for a higher yearly fee per user no monthly charges will clear the dust from here!
      I am OUT

    • Playboyzzz says:

      Try me..

    • Mountianclimber says:

      Hi Marie, Yes things have changed somewhat. There is a wide variety of people on site, male and female… Then there are the Diamond members I know little about, not bc I cannot compete, but bc I will not put that much personal information online…

      That said, what I ultimately want is an LTR with a young, sexy and intense woman… I can’t tell you how many meetups I have had and always seem to be disappointed. My first meet up was with a prostitute using this site as cover… Ok with me, as I have a very open mind, liked her, and enjoyed the time together, but she was not what I was looking for long term…. You know the saying, good guys finish last…. This probably pertains to me, as times have drastically changed in our world… I think I have been conditioned to the ppm and now expect it as the norm, or I am asked what I am offering before meeting up… My response to that question is: it depends on the connection/magic developed between two people. Relationships take time and I think budgets do as well. Obviously, there is a starting point, to me, a meet up to see if there is mutual attraction seems to be the first step…. I also understand and hear there r many people, male and female who are full of it and have no intentions of anything but texting and exchanging pictures…

      So what can be done? For the men, I would pay a higher, annual only fee to be a member… The female side???? Not sure how to fix that problem… Maybe some sort of a verification, IDK….

      So the question remains, did the site change or is it the shift in our society that is showing up on this site??

      Considering the above and looking back at all the experiences I have had, even though my ltr continues to elude me, I do get frustrated, but consider myself enriched by the multitude of contacts and different personalities I have known and learned from…. Yes, even older can learn new tricks, this is one of the benefits of having an open mind and dating younger… There is always something new and exciting to learn… What better than the mind of a young, active woman who still sees the world as a ride along the rainbow…. Beautiful….

      Yes, I do get frustrated and find especially troublesome and sad, when I am presented with a woman with three or more children often from different men, trying to survive in a hard world… As this is not enough, I find these women and many others on site, to be either very hardened, and/or very immature, and are in a financial bind bc of their attitude and ethics… I once had a woman show up with her newborn of two or three months…. I was shocked and saddened for her…

      I enjoy being a mentor and helping, however, when I pick up on this mindset I move on, knowing my efforts will be wasted…

      I respond to you bc you message touched me, and it gives me a chance to be heard by you and hopefully others….

      I am a fair, respectful man, looking for the pleasure of youth (in many, many, ways). I will only treat a woman, or anyone for that matter, with respect. That said, I have an incredibly young thinking mind, can be dark in humor, kinky and thinking about a Polyamorous ltr… My thoughts on a Poly ltr at first glace is obvious, however, upon deeper reflection I see it this way: Being older, (something I can not control), an ltr with a younger woman can only go so far as the time will come when she will want to move on as one day I will become a bore…. However, if a Poly ltr is established, we all get the best of both worlds… I get my cake w/ icing, and the two women get the youthful experience they so need in their lives… It would be nieve for me to think I can keep someone’s interest as I gracefully age. I do think a poly ltr can be ongoing, as it will provide housing, security, and other enhancements too numerous to list here and now…

      Hey, I know I am all over the place in my response to you, but I hope you can read between the lines and take it for what it is worth…. I also welcome anyone’s reply…

      • Anonymous says:

        Don’t waste your time with Diamond Members. Most just use that “title” to receive free attention as their true sugar baby is the site “ie fees” so they feel entitled to free benefits of any of the SBs on here.

  8. Loretta says:

    Looking for fun trips shopping and loving u baby from head to toes can’t wait.

  9. Benjamyn says:

    Hey everyone,

    I’m a Young, Intelligent, Fun, Open Minded gay Australian looking for a very financially secure to rich partner.
    I’d prefer more than a sugar daddy and son relationship but I’m looking for an exciting new adventure.

    Serious men only, Paypal or Bank Deposit. I will relocate for the right guy!
    30, from Australia, currently living in Medellin, Colombia.

    If you’ve been looking for me, message me!

  10. PW says:

    It seems that some of these younger girls are unrealistic about a $$ amount.
    I would not even know where to start for a $$ amount. Maybe it depends on the meeting and if it is a reg thing. I am new to this and trying to feel my way around. I am older than most on here but I have a great personality, I am open minded, romantic and very passionate looking for the same but this seems like a job interview. lol

  11. MARIA 1 SLOT says:


  12. Ellie says:

    I’m new and so far I’ve had a 65 year old offer to meet for a date then he blocked me. Another couple ask how much for an arrangement then when I told them declined. So far I’ve been offered £300 for a date(no mention of physical) which I thought was reasonable. Considering an escort is £150 per hour.
    So why are some men even on here if they aren’t willing to pay for your time and company?!
    Another asked for an overnight arrangement which he literally wanted for free. As I’m unable to accom a hotel would be expected, that is taken into account also my travel.
    I’m unwilling to accept my chosen figure let alone fora night arrangement.

    How do you gauge a decent price without them being put off without pricing yourself too low?! I’m not giving my time, company or anything else for free!.

    • Anonymous says:

      How? Tell them that’s what you’re usually given. And walk away…most important part.

      I found this on the site, thought I’d share it with you.

      By Autumn (September 18,2015 at 5:52 pm) says:

      “It may be best for Babies to accept what is offered and enjoy that before demanding, or even suggesting, a regular amount of cash” That is some bull crap. Ladies, know your worth. No, you’re not an escort but it would be worth your while to do some research and learn what an escort service provides for a client and how much they charge. There are many men on here that don’t want to pay $500-2k for an evening with an escort and they know SB’s will “accept what is offered and enjoy that before demanding” so they prey on us. This is a little secret seeking arrangement doesn’t want you know. These dudes need to remember that we are NOT here for sex. We are beautiful women and don’t need this website for that. If these guys have a problem with that then they should be calling an escort agency. SeekingArrangement should not be seen as place for creepy men to get discount companionship.

      • Anonymous says:

        bla bla bla

      • Anonymous says:

        You’re right. Look most of the men here already see escorts. I did my research and found forms and the like where they laugh about how cheap SBs are and the lies they tell them to do just about anything. Others are banned from escorts for abuse and mistreatment so they come here hoping for new victims. Sorry I had to say it but it’s true so yes SBs need to be extra careful.

  13. Shay says:

    I just signed back up. I found an SD relatively quickly the last time I was up here. He was a great guy, but ironically didn’t make the best financial decisions. Still a great man though. Anyway my ex friend re-vamped my page and made me take off leasing agent as my occupation,and I was like: Okaaaay, but I…am…a leasing agent. She changed a few other things and told me my pictures were shit (which they were I have never been a good picture taker) I don’t know maybe someone can help me..?

  14. new says:

    Have any SB’s looking only for platonic relationships or at least non-sexual relationships had any luck? I wanted to be upfront about my boundaries on my profile, which immediately affected the amount of messages I was getting. That’s fine, since I think it will deter the people who aren’t right for me, even if my responses are significant fewer.

    I’d love to know about any successful and healthy relationships formed that were more like that with a benefactor than a fuck-buddy. Surely not everyone on here is a creep. I don’t need to be someone’s only SB, and I also don’t need much. Please don’t attack me for this, I’m only asking honestly.

    • Thatswhatshe says:

      None that I’ve actually met in person. You can meet platonic on other sites.

    • SugarBee says:

      In the last year or so that I’ve been on Seeking Arrangements I’ve had great luck finding new friends to learn from and do entertaining things with! There are a few conditions that make this arrangement successful though, and if you’re not careful you’re just going to come off as a disingenuous gold digger. The thing about this arrangement that you have to realize is that you’re not a sugar baby. You’re not your daddy’s partner here.. you’re his friend. You’re not entitled to sugar baby benefits if you’re not ever intending on showing him any sugar 😉 If someone decides that they are in the interested in your company and friendship that is awesome… do everything you can to be an entertaining conversationalist and positive person if they are generous enough to spot the bill for all of your fun outings. But that’s where the benefits stop for both of you. It’s not fair to expect someone to fund your life or give you gifts just because you let them take you out… be realistic. It’s totally understandable that you don’t feel comfortable being intimate with your companion, but don’t expect baby benefits when you just want to play buddy.

    • fukoff says:

      You can meet platonics on regular dating sites

  15. Anonymous says:

    Do you think it is a good or bad thing to be a first time sugar baby? Should I let the potential SD know or keep it to myself?

    • EyesOnU says:

      I only told one of my POTs. They can try to fool you and take advantage of you, so just hide that info, I was just lucky that the POT I told I was new at this did not try anything like that with me.

  16. Anonymous says:

    Men view me and some favor me but that is it. The men are not interested in me. What do I do?

    • EyesOnU says:

      Refine your profile… Write things that give a good glimpse about how will SDs have good times with you, and say what do you expect from them. If you already did, then they are just looking for something different and that’s ok.

  17. Anonymous says:

    How to avoid sexual illness
    You can’t just asked, that will be awarded
    Does anyone has great idea?

  18. Anonymous says:

    I have just been told my profile is unusual i am new to this and unsure what I should have written perhaps I was to brutally honest I just don’t see the point in beating around the bush is there a fellow sugar babe that can email me with some suggestions?

  19. kwispel says:

    Who’s actually in charge of marketing on this website???

    These “examples” aren’t really encouraging for SD candidates. Mixing the concepts of gold-digger and sugarbabe?

    If you want to give lessons, then post stories of sugarbabes where things came to a nice mutual agreement, not end up in divorce payments etc. 😉

    Lessons, for sure, but I feel it’s more a lesson for a candidate SD to stay away as far as possible from any SB… Which wasn’t the idea when setting up this site, right?

  20. Anonymous says:

    How do you know if a potential sugar daddy is a cop?????

  21. Minja says:

    Determining and negotiating an allowance/price
    I am wondering if someone could give good advice on how to tell an SD what you expect without them being offended .
    Some men are new or they just think that they can get sex offering 100$ . What would be the best reaction on that offer?
    I know some men do not have a high budget. That offer in my opinion is too low though.
    Even if I enjoy being with an SD i do expect a good allowance to afford my studies.

    Good advice from SD’s appreciated

    • Ms. Phoenix Rising says:

      SD’s will never give advice on how to get more money LOL…sorry ma’am but you may have to get your feet wet and just swim a little. Ask for what you want and walk away from all who don’t comply. Trust they will walk away from you in a heartbeat even after getting what they want so play smart.

  22. Anonymous says:

    Any advice on what I could do if I feel like I made a mistake setting up my initial arrangement with my daddy and want to renegotiate? I always get fumbly and uncomfortable talking about the money/transaction part, so when he gave the example of what he paid in his last arrangement, I agreed to it with only a few questions about what extras it would include. Thinking about it after meeting, I thought of a couple things I wanted to make sure are included (I had a previous arrangement and these things were, but it ups the total $ amount he’d be spending each month). How do I bring this up again without coming across as greedy? I don’t want to make him feel bad or uneasy about the arrangement we just made, but it really was a case of me not giving myself the time to think it through enough. I think I need to start writing my expectations out so I can vocalize more effectively, but what to do in this situation right now?

  23. AaronF says:


    Daisy says:
    May 11, 2016 at 12:19 pm

    I think his account is disabled or deleted but be on the look out for C12H22011Daddy the dude will send you the most disgusting message you’ve ever read. And he opens by stating he has herpes (HSV-2 specifically) and tries to tell you that it’s just part of the risk of being a SB and what not. And then states these outrageous requirements he has of his sugar babies. He is married and his wife knows. He also has children.

    Here are the messages he sent:
    The real SD on this site are older and married, whether we tell you or not.
    I am seeking an OKC area sugarbaby.

    I am positive for HSV-2. The risk of you contracting HSV-2 is the same as the risk of becoming pregnant using an oral contraceptive. Yes, there is risk in being a SB.
    I am the real sugardaddy deal. I am married with child. My spouse is aware of, but does not appreciate my hobby. You will be the “another” woman (mistress). I am a dominant, successful man who has earned the spoils of war. You are my shiny new toy and I am your ATM.

    Do not attempt coy seduction skills that work on hourly employees and bar boys, as you will be next’ed. In my world you will be cared for and are required to be direct. I expect poise, grace, charm, and situational awareness. You can easily cost me much more than your value by not understanding your environment. My interests are my businesses. My taste in entertainment is diverse and eclectic. I enjoy casinos, theater, and concerts. I have very limited time. This requires a dynamic SD/SB relationship. As I mentioned in the profile, I am not your spouse or boyfriend. I will see you when I am available. I will meet you in OKC or surrounding areas. We will have primarily overnight engagements and some afternoon engagements. When I travel, if appropriate, you will be invited. You will be given extended advance notice to make any arrangements. Just got back from a week trip to Seattle (you could have been invited for this one). When attending conferences, I desire a travel companion.

    I require intelligence and the ability to speak intelligently or at least listen with interest to other intellectual elites.

    Many women use this site for prostitution for which I am sure there is a market. However, my view is the SD/SB relationship is more than the base aspects of a sexual relationship.

    I see the SD/SB relationship as having benevolence (both the positive and negative connotation) in that the SD desires to accelerate the SB’s intellectual/economic/educational development while the SB allows the SD to partake in her youth, dreams, and beauty. At least that’s my opinion.

    Additionally, as in any relationship, quid pro quo is the requirement. I assume you understood this when you signed up for this site. To remove sex from the SD/SB relationship removes a key element of the relationship and is a deal killer for any SD. A dominate male wars in nature or business for the femininity of the female. If you don’t understand then either you are naive or just gaming for self-esteem. If you are struggling with your self-esteem, you are perhaps trying to be masculine and competing with males instead of recognizing your value as feminine and complementing males. From your profile, it appears that you understand this truth.

    Either my directness has intrigued you, pissed you off, or perhaps both.
    Let me know if you wish to put your plans into action and we can arrange a voice call to assess comfort.

    I hope that I will hear back from you. If not, I wish you the best. Should you reply, please specify your expectations and provide contact information for a phone interview to assess mutual comfort with escalating.

    Finally, please send high quality face and full body photos to:
    Please include standing swimwear or bra/panty photo to allow assessment of your abdomen and physique.

    Respectfully submitted for your consideration,
    A Real SD

  24. Anonymous says:

    I have a friend on here who is not handicapped but because of bad knees and MS she is looked over because some of the guys only want sex and feel she can’t perform. She’s a lot better that some of the women on here who have good knees. She’s gorgeeous, has a huge heart and is full of fun, love and many other things. So she can’t go hike a mountain and other athletic things but is that a requirement. She’s the type of person who wouldn’t have created a profile if she couldn’t “perform” if that be the case. WTF is wrong with you men? Are you so shallow and uncaring that you would overlook her for those reasons. She’s honest about it as well. she could lie like a lot of the women on here do. You’re truly missing out. She deserves to be spoiled. You’ll know her if you come across her profile. Don’t leave her a messsage if you’re not going to be MAN enough to be honest. She’s got it rough but you will never here heer complain.

    • Anonymous says:

      Please tell your friend not to be discouraged. There are actually some intelligent men who will accept her for who she is is. Honesty is a big plus and I admire her for her confidence. Some men are just really ugly and shallow and think money can buy anything.

    • AaronF says:

      Which state is she in?

  25. Amyra22 says:

    Hi, I’m new to this anyone care to give any advice,tips or constructive criticism on my profile or what I should and shouldn’t do?

  26. Tessa says:

    I’m looking to have some freaky fun.I like to go out in have fun and I also like to do so much morw

  27. puck says:

    I am new, meeting my 1st pot in a couple of days. Spoke on the phone. He wants to meet in a starbucks, said he has time to meet in a hotel afterwards and how many times a month and how much money a month do i want for the arrangement. Is this weird?I said to him let’s just chat. He is all about the sex and money. Only has a photo I sent to him. How do I handle this. I don’t want sex on 1st date.

    • Mayra says:

      draw your line and tell him how it is, dont bend over then cry afterwards about being conned or not getting what you want. If he doesnt want to cooperate hes not the one for you.

    • Anonymous says:

      it’s on this site on the first meeting no sex or money is to be expected on the first meeting this is just to see if there is chemistry and see if both parties want to proceed with a arrangement yes it’s normal to discuss allowance and number of times you can meet but sex is not expected on the first meeting

  28. Times Square Lover says:

    I was recently admonished by a somewhat newby SB as follows: “I hate to break it to you but the only reason girls are on this site is to take your money”. I’d be curious to hear what more experienced sugar babies have to say about this comment.

    • Anonymous says:

      Maybe an apt reply would be ‘and SD’s are only hear to fuck you’ especially if she is one of the newbie ‘free money for platonic’ crowd.

    • anon says:

      That is absurd. I enjoy the company of older men, because they offer a perspective that only comes with time.
      Chemistry is either formed or not… that’s how I base my decisions on CHOOSING a SD… not on how much my allowance is going to be or how high up in the chain he is… though those factors help 😉

      • Anonymous says:

        It’s not absurd really. If most younger women wanted older men this site wouldn’t exist and all of these older men would have scores of young and hot women into them on regular dating sites. Seriously? The reason why she told him this was because he has no intention of providing an allowance and wants a “free relationship with a dinner every now again” with a hot young woman. It’s a nice fantasy thanks to porn but in reality these young women don’t fantasize about men that old unless they’re wealthy (or have a considerable amount more than them) and of course generous.

  29. Anonymous says:


    • noname says:

      that is true she got nothing but it was her husband family that screwed her over not him but this is not unusual many families fight over assets when someone dies thats why ill help those i care about when im alive rather than leave a bundle of money for people to fight over when i die

  30. Anonymous says:

    Sorry but i don’t believe EVERY older/younger relationship is a sugardaddy/baby relationship.Like K-Fed and Mariah Carey, I don’t believe they were based on the sugardaddy/baby thing.

    • noname says:

      your right anon there is a thing called age gap relationship where younger female and males are attracted to older male and females its more common than people think and its not based on money but mutual attraction here on this site are unlikey to do this its a tranaction women want to get paid but in the real world it is possible

  31. Anonymous says:

    So, I’m new here. I don’t really know how all of this works and need advice; No one seems to be interested in my profile. I’d pull the race card and say it’s because I’m black, but I don’t generally believe in that. Does my profile have something wrong on it? I’d be lying if I said I wasn’t confused.

  32. Where my career left me was Medellin Colombia. we have a system down there called prepagos. Few free ladies spend more than a few hours with their man, and the money is quite nice. $300 to $500 for a few hours.

  33. Anonymous says:

    I’m new to the site; and honestly I’m nervous can any sugerbabies or daddies give me any advice. I’m honestly not looking for some guy to pay for my life (nothing wrong with that btw) I’m looking to be a companion.

    • Anonymous says:

      me too, why is it so hard to find /:

      • Yoshi says:

        The irony I find is that there are men like me out there who are looking for a good companion and have been finding it almost impossible to find a nice girl who would want to spend time just having some good clean fun with a sugar daddy. I wish I could start with someone like that.

      • Anonymous says:

        Yoshi — I’m mostly looking for a good companion — but so many say they want sex — but “don’t want an escort type or a prostitute”….what?! That is basically what one is getting if all they want is sex and paying for it….?!

    • THEATLSD says:

      Probably because your profile sucks and you are asking for High or Substantial.

  34. anyone interested in my comments can contact me my cell number is 5926009346 and telephone is 3332790 i would prefer you call me on my telephone because my cell phone is not always with me so bye for now and remember i can be your wife so call me and lets talk note sugar daddies only bye i love you guys mwa

  35. Anonymous says:

    My ex sugar daddy file a lawsuit after I ended the relationship in January, 2014. He bought me a house with 60% of my share, & his has 40% of his share on the deed. He have me a vintage collection crystal bottle, perfumes, & furnitures. He wants them back, & now he sues me for that. I hire a lawyer to handle his lawsuit. We went to a mediation last week. My lawyer proposed his lawyer that I would give the stuffs his client wants if he is willing to give me the house 100% under my name. I broke off with him after I found out that he has another woman in other city, & he bought that woman a luxury condominium 3 times value than the house he bought for me. I had a serious relationship with him because he bought me 7 rings. Some of them are like wedding bands, & he planned to buy me an engagement ring before I broke up with him. It’s more than sugar daddy/sugar baby relationship. I am sure we will go to the court in December. I am not worry about that because I am only a regular person. On the other hand, he is a well known neurosurgeon in his country, & he has been working as a neurosurgeon for more than 10 years in well known private hospital & also a consulting professor in neurosurgery in ivy league university in our city. I think he is dumb enough if he wants to go to the court. He needs to worry about his reputation. I am preparing for the jury trial at the court in December to prove those items are gifts for me. Gifts are gifts. He cannot take them back. It’s unethical. Just because I ended the relationship, he asks me to give the items back. What do you guys think about my situation? I want other sugar babies learn from my experience that you need to protect yourself if something goes bad with your sugar daddy after you end the relationship one side.

    • SD says:

      He might be smart in Medicine but he is a dumb MOFO in love . He gave you the stuff -it is yours. If there is not a contract saying otherwise sell that shit ,move back to where ever you are from with a pocket full of Bucks .

    • noname says:

      anon i agree with SD a gift is a gift he’s not intitled to it back just sell the stuff and give his 40 percent back pocket the rest and have a good life

      • Anonymous says:

        Yes, I plan to sell his collections if I could win them in the court. He might drop the lawsuit. Maybe… If he doesn’t want his reputation ruin in our city. Professor in ivy league university, & famous surgeon in one of the big top name hospital in the US. I am sure many reporters will want to cover this story.

      • Anonymous says:

        Men do idiotic shit all the times. Look at Goerge Clooney. Why the fuck he married that skank.

        “A source close to the couple dished to Star that Amal refused to sign the prenup, and George was in such a hurry to marry her in Italy that they went ahead with the ceremony, even though there was no prenuptial agreement in place.”

        Most likely you will get the house. The idiot did what he did…that’s how women have survived for eons…you are no different.

      • Anonymous says:

        Women have been living off of men for eons by spreading their legs. Enjoy the fruits of the labor provided to him by your pelvic muscles. You have earned it fair and square.

    • Baby Needs You says:

      how the hell did you find a sugar daddy like that that and why cnat i find one…?

      • Anonymous says:

        How can you desire high allowance and lavish gifts when you are a 3/10?

      • Anonymous says:

        I guess I am just lucky I met this surgeon. He liked me at the first moment he saw me. I had a lunch date, but I rejected him because I was not sure at that time. He was generous on that day bought me some Bebe clothes in the mall. Then several months later, he contacted me again. That time I went dinner with him, & I took his offer. 2 months later, he rented one bedroom apartment & paid cash for one year & bought me a brand new Toyota Camry. Not bad for 2 months even though I didn’t do sexual things with him. 5 months later after we met, I had sex with him. I guess I am just lucky after 3 years later he bought me a brand new Lexus, & 5 years later he bought me the house. Now I regret he bought me the house because it’s like a commitment. He owns me. I ended the relationship, & he filed a lawsuit. I plan to contact local tv news few days before the trial date. Stay in tune. You guys might find out who he is if the reporter cover the news about our case.

      • Anonymous says:

        I am just lucky. Sometime when you are not looking or didn’t expect, it would happen. Men just approach you. I am just a simple girl. But I know how to dress sophisticated and carry myself well. Some people said I am very intimidating. Maybe because I am not a flirty person & a bit reserved. Kind of cocky for some people. I always have men with outgoing personality like me. You will find, dear. But just be careful. I’ve learned from my lesson with that surgeon.

      • THEATLSD says:

        …because you don’t know how to spell, your pictures are not to good, and your profile is one big oxymoron. NEXT

    • Luxuria21 says:

      Would you suggest making a contract of some sort?

      • THEATLSD says:

        The only person that should need a contract is a extremely rich SD. Otherwise stop watching 50 Shades. This has been a PSA.

  36. Lola says:

    After spending many years straightening myself out to be a good girl, following the rules, and getting my shit together, I’m starting to see I will be very alone in the having my shit together world, and I will also have zero fun not doing things I am interested in just because I may be judged for them. And, apparently, life has a way of igniting things unexpectedly when you just put yourself out there and say yes to opportunities, regardless of how they may be perceived by others, and without fear of what the result may be. In the end, we can’t ever know what the result will be for sure. All we know is this moment, right here, right now…

  37. nikki says:

    Go spoil me loves

  38. Attica M says:

    never compromise who you are and if something doesnt feel right, go with that feeling.

  39. Willow S says:

    I think I would make an amazing SB 🙂 I am the catering type and want to please a man as well as be spoiled. I am also open to the idea of marriage in the future if we mesh well.

  40. Anonymous says:

    i am looking for a very nice sugardaddy realtionship *

  41. I’d love to see a list of fictitious Sugarbabies as well– there are a ton of inspiring movies!!

    • SBaby says:

      Omg, what great idea!

      Ernie Malone: What are you girls made of? What was that?
      Lorelei Lee: Just equal parts of scotch, vodka, brandy, and gin.

      -From Gentlemen prefer Blondes

  42. DarkHorseSD says:

    EU: please follow along…it’s about the FIRST date.

  43. DarkHorseSD says:

    Sun: “that was nearly half a decade ago. Yelp wasn’t popular yet back then, and I was new to SA”

    We were all new once, and sometimes we still do newbie things, which reminds us why they are newbie.

  44. DarkHorseSD says:

    From Josh: “I don’t let my pots choose the restaurants anymore. The reason is that most of the times they would select a restaurant they wanted to try something silly at someone else’s dime without much regard for the safety reasons suggested on this blog.”

    Yes, this is 50% of the reason for sd to choose the place. Another 50% is quality control I mentioned. I forgot what the other 50% is.

  45. Josh says:


    You do either live in a fantasy world or just write stuff like this to piss real SDs off. Statements like that show how little you know as to how women roll.

    “SB shopping skills should not be under-estimated.”

    That only applies to their hard-earned money. Fathers are not spared waste of his money so what to talk about some “old fart” who is trying get into her panties?

  46. FatB'StardSA says:

    Speaking from my personal experience this would be true.

  47. euphoria says:

    new blog, yay!

  48. Josh says:

    “It is much like the older SD who has never had such a young, hot SB and is excited to try, yes.”

    I am sure the older SD who has “never had such a young, hot SB” may go for it. 😉

  49. euphoria says:

    or we can always just go to hooters, make the sd man of the hour and listen to him sing i’m a little tea pot in front of everyone after 20 beers and post the pictures on the blog for our entertainment. im sure that would be an unforgettable first date experience.
    when all else fails… hooters girls to the rescue. they’re delightfully tacky yet unrefined!

  50. Kms2014 says:

    @NCgent..nope..was not me. Think, katpaw, is moving to NC? So, you probably saw that, perhaps.

  51. euphoria says:

    @josh- actually being in the restaurant industry, Most of the restaurant reviews that I get are actually very different then the reviews that you would get. I also have met met most of the restaurant owners in the area. They drink at my bar and try to hire me all of the time. If I suggest a place for my sd, its going to be a very good private owned restaurant that does not cost 11 billion dollars. I’ve also been fortunate to have been into sugar dating long enough to where ive been just about everywhere and kind of know whats where now. My judgement would be based on what the locals have to say, what some of my former sd’s have to say, the fact that I have actually looked the menu up online already, seen pictures of the place, read the reviews and met the owners and chefs in some cases and read the health reviews for the place.
    If a place happens to have a very unique attractive look to it, good ratings, the locals like it, unique menu options, good lighting, a amazing wine selection and has a A on the health ratings, then its safe to say that it just might be a good place to take a date. But, I do agree that sticking with what you know on the first date is always a safe choice. First impressions are the most important ones.

  52. NC Gent says:

    Did I see you are in NC? I remember scanning the posts last week, and saw someone was near or in NC here.

  53. Kms2014 says:

    Lol, that would have been so funny! It has been about seven months, since our date, too, and he had just recently joined, when we met.

    It is well, and the same to you (:

  54. NC Gent says:

    No, it wasn’t me KMS, but I do like to play doctor. Hope all is well with you!

  55. Kms2014 says:

    @NC gent…you are not an aids research doctor, are you? Knew a NC man once who gave me the option of three restaurants….

  56. […] Lacking a picture doesn’t mean this guy lacks a soul. The men on SA are established, and usually high profile. Withholding his picture should be temporary, but don’t be surprised if he wants to meet in person without sending you a pic. As long as you use common sense and meet in a public place, this guy is no more risky than anyone else online. You never know, it could be Clinton or Hefner behind the mask, and you could be the next famous Sugar Baby. […]

  57. NC Gent says:

    Regarding restaurants, I usually pick three and let the SB choose one or vice versa.

  58. NC Gent says:

    Hi all — been a while since I have posted. About seven months into looking for an SB. It has been about 2.5 years since I looked and things sure have changed! I have a 3rd and 4th date scheduled later this week with a pot that looks really promising. Had several dates with a pot SB I met IRL, but it never really got much past the platonic stage. I had arguably the worst first date ever last week, and I kick myself for ignoring the warning signs – live and learn!

    Not sure how many long term SDs post here, but has anyone else noticed the significant increase in the number of women seeking platonic relationships? Also, there seems to be a lot more people who view SA as a regular dating site (think match) since the last time I looked in earnest. That magical $3k allowance has bit me a few times too 🙂

    Hope everyone’s sugar is sweet and not saccharin!

  59. SunShineSD says:

    SB shopping skills should not be under-estimated.

  60. SunShineSD says:

    It’s only food. I usually take SB’s to upscale seafood restaurants and sushi places. That’s just because that’s the type of venues that I’m familiar with for business purpose. SB’s are always quite happy with them. My ideal however would be giving the SB a budget and let her decide where to plunk us down for dinner or lunch. If she makes a bad choice, she can make up for it after the meal. LOL.

  61. Josh says:


    Once we start our arrangement, I have no problem with my SB picking all or most of the restaurant settings. I actually prefer if she does that. Less work from my part. 😉

    It’s just the first date I am not going to screw up because she wanted to “try something new” based on whatever silly criteria she were using, which might not even work for either of us.

  62. Kms2014 says:

    Perhaps, some young SB are not used to the ‘finer’ things, so is something new for them to try the sometimes overhyped places(and am not speaking of Olive Garden, btw, ehehe!). Good taste isn’t always the most expensive, or new and trendy marketed place, but can be the little family owned, hole in the wall, Columbian place that am going for dinner later! Tres leche cake, oh yeah….Going to some of the high end places trendy places are just new and exciting for some of the young SB, who might have never experienced before…bless…hehe, don’t hold it against them (: It is much like the older SD who has never had such a young, hot SB and is excited to try, yes.

  63. Josh says:

    Food critics are as bad or worse than movie critics. Good for nothing pretentious idiots peddling whatever the fuck they are peddle. 🙁

    And thanks Euphoria for confirming my assertions about SBs’ restaurant selection criteria. LOL!

    Absolutely not that there is anything wrong with that. 😉

  64. euphoria says:

    Omg, i always try to find the most unique restaurants that I just really want to try because they have the best reviews. If a sd denied me the right to choose a restaurant, i would have to make a suggestion that I choose one date and he try the next. I know my choices are usually profound!

  65. euphoria says:

    This was a letter that was copy and pasted and sent to both my profiles. Of course all the guy at least made the effort to insert my name at the beginning and his name at the end. But whats up with all of the generic insert sb’s name here letters. Guys, if you want a real arrangement then just take the time to read the sbs profile and actually write her a genuine response. But if you don’t, and you really just don’t care then and you are in the IT industry, hey… just copy and past the message below message, insert the sb of your desired name at the top of the letter and your own at the bottom and you have your generic copy and paste letter to send out to every girl who looks somewhat attractive. omg, a lesson to all sbs, creating two profiles will actually help you filter BS like this,if the same message goes to both of your inbox’s and all that changes is the name of the sb, then its most likely generic!
    Example of the letter:
    [Dear, Insert name here]
    I am very interested in getting to know you better. You are a very attractive girl. I really like the description in your profile. I am looking for an ongoing arrangement with an attractive young lady like yourself, and I can provide 2000mo in support.I am a busy IT management professional in the ———– area. I am well educated, have a great sense of humor, enjoy travel, and make sure everyone around me is having fun a great portion of the time.
    If you would like to get more info and talk further, please email me back through this website, or you can send me an email to [email protected]. You can also call/text me at ***** *** ** *** if you are interested.
    [Insert name here]

  66. Josh says:

    Some of the bloggers live in a fantasy world I am not familiar with. Some of the allegedly “male” bloggers write stuff as if a woman were writing it. What’s up with that?

    I don’t let my pots choose the restaurants anymore. The reason is that most of the times they would select a restaurant they wanted to try something silly at someone else’s dime without much regard for the safety reasons suggested on this blog.

    And yesn I have a very good taste in restaurant selection thank you and I don’t want an inexperienced young girl to pretend that she has better taste or more experience than me. Their “taste” is primarily BS picked up from someone else’s marketing efforts.

  67. euphoria says:

    blog gods, can you please remove the first of my last two posts. actualy did not mean to put somebody’s email into the actual post and i did not mean to submit it the way the first post stated. thank you.

  68. Kms2014 says:

    @darkhorse, yes, I am addressing you….Some SB have very good restaurant taste, while others think Olive Garden is considered fine dining. And, would think, some cheap/fake SD would be very happy about said choice–the chef boyardee of Italian restaurants equivalent, so to speak!

  69. SunShineSD says:

    Also, that was nearly half a decade ago. Yelp wasn’t popular yet back then, and I was new to SA. If in a similar situation now, I’d offer her gas money to come to me so we can go to a better restaurant.

  70. SunShineSD says:

    Agree with you in principle. However, sometimes the location of the SB can be in such a remote/blah place that fulfilling both principles of going to her on first date and picking a good restaurant would be impossible. IIRC, all I could find within 5-10 miles of her location were either “family restaurant” chains like Olive Garden and Red Lobster or restaurants that I never heard of. That’s why I had to let her pick if I was not to ask her to come to me, over an hour drive away.

  71. SunShineSD says:

    My ex-wife is essentially on a package like that from me. I pay her more than 15x the national average for child support (more than 20x the national median), far in excess of the divorce decree specifying 5x half a decade ago. In other words, her benefits from me is not due to the divorce decree but because of my choice due to her being the mother of my child. She also adopted a child with my support years after divorce. She and I have not been romantically involved after divorce; in fact, we were separated for two years before divorce. She is certainly free to date, and I trust her not to endanger the safety of the children. She did have a crush on somewhat of a slacker during our separation before divorce, but she got that out of her system after dating him for a few months. After dating perhaps half a dozen single-parent professionals in 3-4 years and putting herself on voluntary celibacy for a year, I think she recently started dating a doctor.

    I put them in a house of their own in a very nice town about 10 miles from my own house. Both she and I are happier than when we were married, so is the kid. One of the crucial reasons I think is that each can do his/her own financial planning. Cost of living savings from sharing a roof is really insignificant when compared to much more substantial financial decisions. That’s why I’m seeking to make serial arrangements just like, dating to post-marriage amicability and the bliss of co-parenting, skipping the marriage contract itself.

  72. KatPaw says:

    Lol the internet is for porn

  73. DarkHorseSD says:

    Sun wrote: “Perhaps the SB picked Olive Garden?”

    On June 3 it was suggested the SB should pick the place for a first meeting. Be a good enough SD that the SB SHOULDN’T pick the place.

  74. DarkHorseSD says:

    ATM posted: “@DarkHorseSD The benefits of internet porn? I hold some truths to be self evident.”

    But can you provide a users manual – errr so to speak?

  75. KatPaw says:

    Good morning sugarrrrrs

  76. aliceS says:

    And, btw does anyone else, had the experience of his sb being pregnant with him (sd)? If yes, do you force her to do an abortion or you wait til she gave birth and then you verify if you are the father for sure?

  77. aliceS says:

    Morning infidels 🙂
    Sunshine do you have at least one baby like that already? And if you do where did you keep them? I mean both mother and child? And what if your baby momma will want to date later an Xbox player? She is allowed to do so? Or not really?

  78. flyR says:

    Good Sugar Is Not Just Free, It Comes With a Bonus .

    A great SB should be able to market herself as a great force multiplier, increasing the SD’s income far beyond her tiny allowance.

    No more hours spent prowling the singles bars or recovering therefrom, no more mid week depression for Wednesday is play night and serious play is on the menu. All of this adds up to a dozen or so more productive hours where the gain from just one exceeds the cost of the SB.

    It’s sad to see many young SB’s “selling ” hamburger by the pound rather than thinking of their potential positive impact.

  79. flyR says:

    The definition of “unemployed” is as slippery as the definition of virginity.

    On the side of lower unemployment than reported you have a rapidly growing portion of the population working for cash. In addition to the tax savings and inconvenience of being here illegally, not reporting employment or income opens the pandora’s box of benefits.

    On the other side of the scale unemployed excludes folks who have given up looking for work, and Phd’s working as Starbucks barristas additional millions have been shuffled off to the rolls of the disabled (funds come from the social security fund not the deficit)

    Tragically there are millions of kids who have never seen an adult get up in the morning and go to work.

  80. Kms2014 says:

    I want to date an Italian man now, and ask him to take me to Olive Garden or a macaroni Grill…then act very serious and explain how ‘authentic’ the food is and is why I suggested it, hehehe!!

  81. SunShineSD says:

    Perhaps the SB picked Olive Garden? Since the SD was coming to her from far away. I had that happen to me once. Being from a small town, she picked Olive Garden and I did not feel like insulting her by asking for a better restaurant. No, I did not ask for a blow job in the parking lot afterwards. LOL. She wanted to sit in my car and talk afterwards, which lasted half an hour and I made sure to lower the top of my convertible first, so whatever happened was clearly visible from afar. At the beginning of the dinner she told me her BF was a cop. I figured it was either a silly lie she learned to keep herself safe or her boyfriend really was a cop. Either way I was not keen about her or taking unwarranted risks.

  82. DarkHorseSD says:

    Then also consider, is it really just the same phenomenon as the woman who has multiple examples of being abused and underpaid by her bosses. No matter what, are you going to end up being an sd in a bad story?

  83. FatB'StardSA says:


    The benefits of internet porn? I hold some truths to be self evident.

  84. FatB'StardSA says:


    When you say your pot SB “worked out her forearm a little bit” was she giving you a hand job or was she furiously texting you?

    Sorry, you walked into that one.


    Still milking the “baby farm” I see. It stopped being funny a long while ago. Can you come up with anything else?

  85. Josh says:


    “Do people make up horror stories as leverage to get involved with someone, likely in a dishonest way?”

    I sometimes wonder about the same.

    Either the stories are highly edited for dramatic effect or there are some very dumb SDs out there. I lean towards the former. 😉

  86. DarkHorseSD says:

    “Pot SD#3-He showed up in a newer BMW well dressed. He drove 2 hours away from the town they were in to eat at a Olive Garden. Then asked for a BJ in the parking lot……..when she refused he said “I knew you were a waste of time” drove her home in almost complete silence.”

    Service at Olive Garden isn’t all that fast usually, right? And begging for a blow job takes a few minutes. So it sounds like this first date was a 6 hour marathon.

    Do we believe this really happened? Do people make up horror stories as leverage to get involved with someone, likely in a dishonest way?

    • Anonymous says:

      Once i went out for drinks with a pot. I had one drink because at the time was 20. He took me to see his office and then managed to rape me.

      shit happens like that in real life

  87. DarkHorseSD says:

    On top of all my other charms, I’ve gotten much more into seafood lately. It’s driving the ladies wild.

  88. flyR says:

    “Most of the women I have been with in or outside of sugar world did not care for oral” VS Sunshine and others

    There’s no right or wrong but rather choices. It’s best if the SD & SB have some congruency between expectations of each. It may also be a self fulfilling prophecy in that women who are with men who enjoy oral sex find it more enjoyable than women who are with men who feel it is beneath then and that the are coerced into it.

    I can see where a woman might be turned off by the SD who has prepared for the act in a way that looks more like a north sea diver plunging into the depths.

  89. kms2014 says:

    OPM…Is that music to the ears of most women, on SA, hehe ;-p

  90. SunShineSD says:


    Good to see you swing by. Perhaps your post was meant for someone else. In case it was meant for me, my “always near-zero” comment was referring to the fact that everyone has to make a living somehow: normal legit jobs, theft and drug dealing, or theft and drug dealing in the name of government monopoly, or simply keeping family and friends happy in exchange for room+board+pocket money. The real private sector job participation rate for working age population is around 60-65% for the US, and less than 50% for most of Europe. All the rest of the population are hangers-on, whether they live off welfare, distribute welfare via public theft, or help themselves to other people’s money directly via private theft.

  91. DarkHorseSD says:

    Please stop writing about this a call fatbastard in to explain the benefits of Internet porn.

  92. Josh says:

    The unemployment rate is discretionary in my neck of the the woods. Those who want to work have a job, and those who don’t want to work have Obama, churches, medicaid, food stamps, friends and family, and lest we forget meth.

  93. kms2014 says:

    like I said before…lots of Econ witchdoctory..lol.

  94. Josh says:

    Whatever that means SunShineSD, 😉

  95. SugarySpicey says:

    No Sunshine, the effective unemployment rate (the U-6) is 14.3%. – Forbes, June 5.

  96. kms2014 says:

    yes, Jj, that is true…US is so large that one can get a better idea by going by state you reside, really.

  97. SunShineSD says:

    Remember, my ex-SB was/is a licensed nurse.

  98. KatPaw says:

    Well interesting reading! Good evening sugars!

  99. Josh says:


    “Trying to explain to the Urologist how you get UTI from fecal matter would not be fun.”

    Seems like you hang around dumb clueless medical “experts”? 😉

  100. Jj says:

    Kms: The “effective” unemployment rate in the US of potential job seekers; including those who have given up for the time being, is over 18.7%; with some estimates as high as 24%

  101. Josh says:


    What you are peddling on the blog for many months is equivalent to a selfie of a stale well-done new york strip. 50c is a fair price to buy a loosey with. 😉

  102. euphoria says:

    Ha, and just as the conversation gets good, I have to return to the bar. Have a good rest of your day everyone!

  103. SunShineSD says:

    I have always used wraps when entering backdoor. Trying to explain to the Urologist how you get UTI from fecal matter would not be fun.

  104. SunShineSD says:

    Or switch wraps and flavors.

  105. SouthernSB says:

    E-Coli city!!!

  106. euphoria says:

    OOOh, and lets be real here. If you let them go anal, give oral first! Never give it after unless its been washed thoroughly. I’ve seen this happen in a few porn flicks and that’s a total mood killer.

  107. SunShineSD says:

    “I have always been fortunate enough to be able to walk into any town anywhere and pick up a job whiten an hour and start making good money by the end of a week of training.”

    Good looks, friendly personality, quicker learner, and lack of bad habits like need for frequent smoke breaks, combined produce a highly productive candidate for employment. Employers hiring you can probably generate more sales on the day you work their than they pay you. Hence you are hired. As simple as that. Unfortunately for much of the rest of the population, the threshold of their own productivity is low. Combined with high minimum wage, the only jobs they can have become:

    1. filing papers for government welfare;
    2. illegal jobs;
    3. living off family and friends.

    Personally I think unemployment is always near-zero if all those three types are counted as employment. The legit-job participation-rates among the working age population however are quite low the world over.

  108. SunShineSD says:

    Euphoria wrote:

    “Note to all SB’S- Give oral. Play with your sds balls. It keeps them around longer. Trust me, I have had enough sd’s to know this. Enough said!”

    Couldn’t have been said better 😉

  109. SunShineSD says:

    You are assuming the SB’s opportunity cost is zero. Try tell a classy restaurant any amount of dollar from you would be better than if you didn’t visit them. LOL. You are just too used to desperate vendors.

  110. euphoria says:

    Note to all SB’S- Give oral. Play with your sds balls. It keeps them around longer. Trust me, I have had enough sd’s to know this. Enough said!

  111. Kms2014 says:

    Heard from someone who lives there…this wasn’t a number I got from any data. Sometimes, real life and data can be off…plus, depending on what area, yes…

  112. Josh says:


    “As far as the previous she is still a sweetheart I can tell by her kiss that when we are intimate she is giving 85% not 100% and that rubs me wrong.”

    Amen to that!!!

    I totally respect a man who can dig if a girl is giving 85% and not 100%.

    Not too long ago, my criteria used to be that it a woman was not 98.785% into me then I would trade her for someone who was 98.786% into me.

    But the times have changed. Now I am good if a woman is 50.001% into me. I trust her with her xbox player 49.999% of the times.

  113. Josh says:

    50% unemployment in Italy?

    Unfortunately Financial Times does not agree with you, but what does FT know anyway about Europe, yes? 😉

    “Italy: Unemployment remained stubbornly high at 12.6 per cent in April. That was slightly below the 12.8 per cent consensus forecast of economists polled by Bloomberg, and flat against March’s revised rate, but still underlines the challenges that Matteo Renzi, prime minister, faces in reinvigorating Italy’s sluggish economy.
    While unemployment has begun to head down in other parts of the eurozone periphery, Italy’s remains near its highs – albeit still comfortably below the equivalent rates in Portugal, Greece or Spain.”

  114. Kms2014 says:

    Then again, another calculation is the ‘real’ unemployment rate for US, which is over 10%….me tinks..Econ witchdoctery, hehe

  115. Josh says:


    “If you offer only selfishness in bed (no oral) on top of low price, well darn, you might as well put out a sign that says “call me only when your rent is due.””

    What is with you and oral at any cost even with a dental dam?

    Since when oral has become epitome of female sexual satisfaction? Most of the women I have been with in or outside of sugar world did not care for oral. Most of them didn’t/don’t want anything but a penis in their vaginas. If a woman wants oral so be it.

    As far as rent, X amount of real dollars earned by SBs are doggone preferable to months of fantasy talk, which cannot be cashed against a single old penny.

  116. euphoria says:

    @Zack- I have started to invest some of my money and think about the long term goal. I actually have the education to fall back on. At any point, if I get tired of bar-tending, I will go into restaurant management or back into real estate and continue to invest into what I am hopping to be stable investments. I have also set myself up to be very versatile career wise. I’m also coinciding finance school in the near future, but don’t know if I actually have the personality for it. It seems like a pretty stressful job.

  117. Kms2014 says:

    Actually, is substantially higher in all parts of eurozone, except Germany, I believe? Heard Italy is at 50%? Is worse than I thought…many Americans do not realise this…

  118. Kms2014 says:

    America’s unemployment rate isn’t as high as compared to some parts of Europe…could be worse. It’s at 6.30% right now.

  119. Tyffeni says:

    Ok, first. That Sterling SB is truly scary. Where did he find her, and how in the world does he find her attractive? Ha.

  120. euphoria says:

    @SunshineSd- I actually went ro school and got a career certificate for bar-tending. It was a 40 hour course and about $500 but it been more then worth it. I also hold a Bachelor’s Its actually Business Management with an emphasis in Hospitality. I took wine tasting course.s and also hold about 5-5 other career certificates. I do agree that people should always look for some forum of higher education regardless of what they do with their life and it always helps to be well versed just in case plan A falls through.I have never gotten why america has such high unemployment rates, I have always been fortunate enough to be able to walk into any town anywhere and pick up a job whiten an hour and start making good money by the end of a week of training. Regardless of what career path people choose, I feel that they should always have some sort of skill that they can fall back on.

  121. Kms2014 says:

    Very true, Josh…(:

  122. SouthernSB says:

    I’m in for a good seafood dinner, with cheesecake and a side of good lovin’, of course.

  123. DarkHorseSD says:

    What about a really good seafood dinner instead of oral?

  124. Eloquence says:

    @ Sun

    Who posted @ Josh

    The type of package you offer has a huge impact on what kind of SB you get. If you go into a market offering only $3.50/lb for beef, chances are that you are not getting fillet mignon; ground chuck is most likely what you will get at the price point.

    If you offer only selfishness in bed (no oral) on top of low price, well darn, you might as well put out a sign that says “call me only when your rent is due.”

    This is What SB’s have been screaming at you guys for forever… Ello!!!!

    Call me when the boat is sinking from the leak that you ignore, and I’ll blow the sail back above water for you so the wind will catch you and drive…hahahaaaaa

    Please forgive me, back to your regularly scheduled program… 🙂

  125. Josh says:


    The same goes for hetro men. SA should not be the only source of female companionship for them. 🙂

  126. Kms2014 says:

    Well, that can be true. Although, I know many men who seek this stability as well. It is what it is…I took a big pay cut leaving the investment industry but am very glad for this. Was never my calling….that’s why I went back to school to do something else…and the freedom it offered to travel and work..pretty much anywhere.

    I’ve had a POT ask me, in the past, about why and how he was surprised I didn’t marry rich, and that I could have very easily? He didn’t know my education, finances or family, when he said this. Part of the reason I do this, is for the excitement and adventure…it certainly isn’t the most stable thing to do, so never recommend women doing this as their only source of income.

  127. SunShineSD says:


    You do realize DarkHorse was joking about franchise potential, don’t you?

    SB’s obviously do hope to make financial and/or other gains on the site, one way or another.

    If you meant 2 & 3 for me, well I don’t need the site to get rich; I’m already in the high net-worth category. The talk about return on investment is so that the SB can be funded in the long run when the subjective value of sex itself diminishes below what her time is worth doing normal jobs, which from SA statistics seem to have a horizon of 3 months or so.

  128. SunShineSD says:

    There is nothing wrong with women seeking stability, and bet their future on sure bets instead of long shots. They are evolutionarily conditioned to bet that way regarding their genetic future. Women are like natural bureaucrats, with limited upside potential and limited downside risk, unlike the drastically more volatile reproductive success profile for men.

  129. Josh says:

    There you go…

    1. Come to the blog.
    2. Inanely talk about a cocomamie scheme.
    3. Hope to get rich.
    4. Repeat.

  130. Josh says:


    One way to avoid being called a john is to call someone else’s sugar experience as john-like.

    Some of these character do just that with impunity. 😉

  131. SunShineSD says:

    @DarkHorse, LOL.

  132. Kms2014 says:

    I interviewed wherever I could…had a few interviews at small firms, too, and a hedge fund later on, back in those days. Was about opportunities, not stability. If that were the case, I wouldn’t have stopped doing that and went into something else later, hehe.

  133. Kms2014 says:

    I was straight out of college, SSD…was not ready to start my own hedge fund yet…lol! And the many men who worked at big FInance firms favour stability more as well. Seriously?

  134. Kms2014 says:

    Tales from the ‘John’ side, lol! It is good that even though you were not interested in her, long term, due to a few freckles, you let her get her forearm workout on, while on ‘date’..so sweet and classy.

    In all your sugar experience, you have only had one who was ‘all in’, you mean, one that really wanted to? Well, of course, if you treat them as an escort…what do you expect?

  135. DarkHorseSD says:

    Sun, structure it as a franchise so you can get franchise fees from people trying it out for you, which all should be return enhancing.

  136. SunShineSD says:

    Lehman was not hiring its 10th or 100th employee at the time. You were seeking a job at a 100+ years old company a decade ago. Goes to show women do prefer stability and established firm 😉 In any case, if it were a start-up, with the 1st 10 positions filled by nerdy males, a female candidate would have a huge advantage for the 11th position, while taking significantly less career risk than the first 10 guys working through 2-3 moves in a couple years including starting in a garage somewhere.

  137. DarkHorseSD says:

    By the way, the cost of gas for 4 hours of driving is more than what I hear you can get a meal for two at Olive Garden for.

  138. DarkHorseSD says:

    gtt – this proves the point of going for experience. By the time she got to you she’d learned from not giving the BJ and you got a hand job.

  139. Kms2014 says:

    Depends on who might be doing the hiring, though, doesn’t it? Had an interview many many years ago, at Lehman, once…it was a woman…and she did not care how cute I was. Even though she did comment how ‘in shape’ I looked back then, hehehe!

  140. gtt_envy says:

    Another date last night just more reality for those that care. She is 20 has been on the site 4 months and so far her experience has been the following in a majoy city in the South:

    Pot SD#1-Emailed constantly they seemed to get along, but when it was time to meet something always came up on his end. “I’m on my way”, “There is alot of traffic” but a NO SHOW this happened twice. She blocked him at that point.

    Pot SD#2-Same thing just empty promises and wanted lots of pics never showed up.

    Pot SD#3-He showed up in a newer BMW well dressed. He drove 2 hours away from the town they were in to eat at a Olive Garden. Then asked for a BJ in the parking lot……..when she refused he said “I knew you were a waste of time” drove her home in almost complete silence.

    We went out last night and she was not nearly as pretty as her pics made her out to be. Pics were definitely filtered as she was moderately tan while in real life she was freckles and paler. Cute, but nothing I would go after longterm. We had dinner, a drink (I did, and she talked about everything under the sun. I did get a hotel, as I usually do, just some kissing and she worked out her forearm a little bit.

    That was her experience so far.

    As far as the previous she is still a sweetheart I can tell by her kiss that when we are intimate she is giving 85% not 100% and that rubs me wrong. In all of my sugar experience I’ve only had 1 that was all in!! Or at least had me cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs that she was.

    Keep on looking time 😉

  141. SunShineSD says:

    I’m looking for returns, not funding.

  142. SunShineSD says:

    Girls have unique advantages. Just like for venture capitalists, the reward/risk ratio is much better when investing in a business that is already showing signs of success instead of the early idea stages. It’s much easier for a cute/hot girl to be the 10th to 100th employee of a rapidly growing company.

  143. DarkHorseSD says:

    Sun, exactly. With all those millions chasing you for your idea and your skillfully written business plan and polished presentation, you will get funded (not that you need it) in a way that will steer you into a successful fool proof implementation.

  144. Kms2014 says:

    There are several reasons…old boys club, lack of female interest, and firms that just do not hire females..finance tends to be more male dominated, anyways, but venture capital is much more skewed. I need to reread it, since it has been about 10 years, since I read it, hehe. Will try to find it…has been about ten years, since I last read it. Wonder if things have changed much?

  145. SunShineSD says:

    Ideas and lessons are scalable. Learning from parallel experiments would make the endeavor less costly in terms of mistakes and time.

  146. SunShineSD says:

    LOL. I don’t want to be the only guinea pig.

  147. Josh says:


    ““Only a fool learns from his own mistakes. The wise man learns from the mistakes of others.” — Otto von Bismarck”

    So are you looking for fools to make mistakes with your bright idea?

  148. SunShineSD says:

    I spent a lot of time in college entrepreneurship / venture capital context some two decades ago, when that was not yet popular, and $10k was the size of an annual prize for the one idea getting funded (well, runner-up’s often got funded too). How times change 😉 Women were quite well represented, no worse than the engineering school population in general; even if not for coming up with the winning business idea itself, their choice to be the “2nd comer” picking winners after winners emerge is a good strategy in the high risk high reward field.

    Why I’m not playing in that field? Because that field is already very well funded since the 1999 tech boom; the annual prize became $100k, then even bigger. With millions if not billions chasing the same number of ideas and talents, that particular field reached diminishing return more than a decade ago. What I have discovered after spending some time on SA is that many women born into less privileged socioeconomic circumstances are no less entrepreneurial than their well-bred sisters; they just never had the exposure to something that is highly profitable and still legal!

  149. Josh says:


    “I did a grad project once, on lack of females in venture capital.”

    What was the premise of the project?

  150. Kms2014 says:

    I did a grad project once, on lack of females in venture capital. Do you know many venture capitalists, SSD? If so, why don’t you hang out at one of your local colleges you spoke about earlier, and instead of being the older creepy guy at the playground with a bag of Candy, you could bring a bag of Herve Leger dresses or Goyard purses? Make sure to hang out at the undergrad business school area, so that the women are not completely clueless about business, and have at least taken Acct 101 and Econ 101, so that you do not have to groom, from square one. Maybe, business theory is better than the girls who have maybe taken applied business courses…might be able to relate more.

    Sure would be refreshing if some new topics were discussed. It’s great you want to be some sort of baby farm mentor but the topic does get so old. Poor Halcyon, in Oz, is trying to be entertained by blog posts but she gets ‘how to pick and start your baby project from scratch, in theory, not practice’ everyday this week…

  151. SunShineSD says:

    DarkHorse, the venture capital world has its own SB entrepreneurs and groupie SB’s. LOL. Most typical SB’s are at the pre-entrepreneur state, where they still need to learn how the business world works and how they can put the business case together present to normal venture capitalists. Hopefully I can help them along the way to their bigger dreams, laying the foundation for them in terms of good entrepreneurial habits and initial seed capital (standing in for the usual friends-and-family stage before the normal venture capitalists are willing to invest).

  152. DarkHorseSD says:

    Ah! The old texting me with updates routine.

    Now that one was invented with cell phones. Lol

  153. DarkHorseSD says:

    Ah! The old texting me with updates routine.

  154. DarkHorseSD says:

    Sun. Have you considered presenting to a venture capital forum?

  155. SunShineSD says:


    Real estate management is only one of many positions where yield-to-time commitment is high thanks to the capital doing most of the work. The mother/SB will need the time to take care of the baby, herself and her education or exploring other career paths if she wishes, so it has to be a high paying job that does not take much time. Sterling seemed to have had similar thoughts when he bought the duplex for his SB, probably as part of a retirement plan for her.

    Many other jobs can be high paying while requiring relatively little dedicated time requirement, from something as low as rubber-stamping whatever needs approving or paid to as high as C-levels officer in a big corporation with near-monopoly in certain market segments to keep an eye on things and bring the warm body to cast the votes when necessary; in between we have executive assistants, retained legal consul, tenured professorship, membership in orchestra, etc., etc., all traditional fertile grounds for SB’s depending on their unique personal talents and aspirations.

  156. Richard says:

    Regarding waiting for late potential SBs. I considered leaving after they were late, but I’d have wasted all the effort getting to a first meeting. And they were continually texting me with “updates.” If I’d left after 15 minutes I would have only met one woman so far. If I’d left after 30 minutes probably only four.

    I’ve decided to give a fair bit of latitude on a first meet and usually just pretend I’m in Italy and answer emails and texts while waiting. If it goes past a first meet I make it clear that I’m not going to wait in the future (in a joking way so it doesn’t sound like I’m a pretentious a$$hole) and the intelligent ones get it. If they don’t, then I consider it a gift and move on. 😉

    Might be a NY/LA kinda thing.

  157. Zack says:

    @ DH: Care to recap any generalizable “lessons learned?”

    @ Suns: It sounds like the enterprise you envision for your child’s mother would be in real estate? Certainly, the idea of mentoring and setting up a business or career shows up across multiple blogs, though the nonprofit idea didn’t seem to garner much attention. I think I see almost as many SB profiles stating an interest in running their own business as I do straight out escorts. (Well, maybe not, but a significant fraction.) Hmm, about half of those are in fashion, though… Perhaps the blog could start franchising Sugar Bars? lol

    @ Euphoria: I’d say you’re showing more entreprenuership than your MBA coworker, but as far as a long term plan, are you sticking with bartending?

    I think a desire for wealth-accumulation rather than simple income often shows up as a desire to start a business or get higher education. Those goals are great, but don’t work well as ends in themselves without being able to work out “how” something productive is created. I believe Suns has given more thought to this than most. That conversation has gotten bogged down in attack and defense though.

  158. SunShineSD says:

    “Only a fool learns from his own mistakes. The wise man learns from the mistakes of others.” — Otto von Bismarck

    I hope by sharing the idea, other SD’s having the means will start experimenting on their own and swapping notes, so there can be an institutional knowledge base that does not have to be re-learned again and again at each one’s own expense.

    Josh, there is some element of truth to your contention of “proactive relationship sabotage”: women are very competitive creatures despite their demure appearances. That trait evolved in the caveman days as their way of driving their partners into taking limited resources from other men so their own off-springs would be better taken care of (at the expense of others’!); in the caveman days, it’s even advantageous for the woman’s genes for her to become a such a shrew and utter pain the neck after she passed prime reproductive age, so the rest of the clan would kick her out of the cave to make room for the younger generation . . . just like the male preying-mantis evolved to have his own head bitten off to ejaculate, so his body would be the female preying-mantis’ nutritious meal while incubating eggs fertilized by his sperms. Certain Eskimo tribes still let the mother use up her teeth grinding up food for the baby because her well being after reproductive age is irrelevant to the genetic future.

    Of course, we now live in a society where women past reproductive age can still lead very productive and happy lives. That’s why certain ancient genetic traits that served her genes eons ago may have to have their expressions limited, just like nowadays we discourage men from fist fights. Not having a marriage would go a long way towards limiting the petulance of both parties, especially when the economic advantages of shared household for children can be replaced via other means, means that promote middle class virtues instead limiting capital accumulation and career development like government aid programs do.

    I’m based out of a state that explicitly rejects legal standing for “common law marriage,” so no legal marriage literally means no marriage, end of sentence full stop. There is no marriage to sabotage and get herself kicked out of. Mother’s rights will be supported by agreements and child-support mandates outside the marriage framework, and she will enjoy plenty freedom and help, more so than in most marriages and divorces.

    As for the safety of money, one does not make above-average returns without taking risks and opportunities.

  159. Halcyon says:

    *popcorn* Ah, it’s been a while since I followed the vapid SA blog entries but to be honest, to hell with the blog, it’s the comments section that’s GOLD! Hilarity (and clear cut insecurity) always ensues, and the time difference between you guys and me in Western Australia means I always have some reading to catch up on. Thanks for keeping this slightly-older SB highly entertained!! 🙂

  160. Josh says:


    As you can see all of us are eager for you to start your project to see how it pans out for others to potentially follow. 😉

    That said, what you are doing is nothing new. Men with resources have done that for eons by getting married to women who met certain criteria to propagate their “super” genes.

    Having financial means allowed them to attract the kind of women they believed were wife/mother material.

    Regardless of how magnanimous, caring, monogomous they were, most men DIDN’T (and still DON’T) factor in the element of proactive relationship sabotage by women.

    The situation is getting worse by one divorce court judge after the other who have been awarding insane amounts of monies to the very saboteurs.

    The twist you bring to the table is that you are not marrying the women involved and hence avoiding the laws against polygyny, and community property laws until one or more of your SBs sabotage the arrangement, one or more savvy lawyers are engaged and a liberal judge catches up to you.

    So as long as your rent-a-womb fantasy keeps torturing us here, your money is safe in the bank where it rightfully belongs. 😉

  161. DarkHorseSD says:

    Sunshine: u r write. Pass go, collect 200 and launch the project today.

  162. SunShineSD says:

    Also, if having a degree is important, there are bar-tending degrees too. LOL. Reminding one of the last scene in Wizard of Oz, the paper degree the “wizard” hands out to the scare crow man.

  163. SunShineSD says:

    Bar tending is direct service to the customer, with, as you can see, intensive workload on the bar tender. It should indeed make more money than many liberal arts bachelor’s degrees. It would be a sad day if a PhD in gender studies or race studies twiddling his/her thumbs somewhere in an AC’d office or teaching gender hatred and race hatred to gullible students make more money than a hard working bar-tender serving members of various different genders and races.

  164. SunShineSD says:

    Point well taken. That’s why I won’t divulge the identity of the people involved. It was simply an accidental anonymous study on what kind of emotional pain a girl has to go through after being accidentally knocked up by some loser who never had intention of taking up the parental responsibilities and never made any preparation to take up such responsibilities. In most cases, abortion would have been the consequence.

  165. SunShineSD says:

    The first couple posts from me yesterday evening was illustrating the details, specifically answering Josh’s rhetorical question earlier: what are the odds of SB receiving millions in benefits over 20-30 years. I was reluctant to divulge the secret source earlier during the week, but seeing that the related question how high allowance can be sustained over long term . . . the answer is making it profitable not just for the recipient but also profitable to the giver. A way to catch fish will produce far more fish than giving fish for one day.

  166. euphoria says:

    @sunshine sd- If I ever decided to make a choice as personal as having an abortion, especially that late during the pregnancy… I would only hope that the people I had decided to trust with that secret would not talk so openly about it on a blog. That is a very private matter and its very sad to see it put out there for everyone to see.

  167. euphoria says:

    @Darkhorsesd- you seem a little confused. I actually work 5 days per week. 2 of those shifts are doubles. I make about $300 per night shift plus my base pay. If you do it correctly then you report 100% and that is highly taxed. Plus if you are a nice bartender/server you tip out the buss boy and the host at the end of your shift weather its requires or not. Your base pay usually only covers your taxes. If im working a day shift which usually consist of both serving and bartering you make a little less but not too much. The other two days your so tired from pulling such long work days that you want to go home and pass out or you cant sleep at all. I’ve tried to change jobs,but I have not found anything as profitable for me yet. Whats sad is that most of the people that work behind the bar with me actually have some forum of higher education and still make more behind the bar then in what they studied for in school. I recently went to a co- workers house and found that he has a MBA from the Berkeley sitting on his wall.

  168. euphoria says:

    @josh- Damm right… I only worked from 2pm-11pm today so its a light day. Tomorrow is where the real fun begins. 9am-12pm with a 30 min break where people will probably ask for anything and everything on my lunch. But hey somebody has to do it, or nobody would ever get a drink!

  169. DarkHorseSD says:

    SunShineSD: You really have to work on the details of this idea of yours because right now it is an unworkable mess and for months you’ve only posted the same sketchy concepts without any progress toward a real working plan.

    You’ve got to start recognizing the flaws, especially in how you believe human nature really works, and creating solutions that address what will be the actual problems.

    You probably have to make a bunch of additional mistakes to start seeing how human nature really works.

  170. DarkHorseSD says:

    Josh: I’m separating the characateurs and the substance, and posting on the substance while musing over the characateurs quietly to myself and wondering what it would be like to masturbate to Internet porn.

  171. SunShineSD says:

    I have no idea who or what you are referring to as “psychopath” or “her playbook.” As far as I know, you are the psychopath repeatedly picking on my posts.

  172. DarkHorseSD says:

    Josh, I can only report what I read right here. 2 shifts a day, 300/shift everyday, and then do the math…18,300 per month

    I think she should try to take off day 366 next leap year and if that feels any good consider a night off every few months.

  173. DarkHorseSD says:

    Josh: yes the images are indelible. I simply have the good grace to ignore those sleazy aspects about you and focus only on the good.

  174. Josh says:


    I am a bot confused…Does she make a killing somewhere else and then makes $300/shift at the bar or she makes a killing primarily at the bar?

  175. Josh says:

    *figment of her fertile imagination. The psychopath lives on through her posse.

  176. DarkHorseSD says:

    Euphoria is probably getting off her second shift at work in a couple of hours.

  177. Josh says:

    I must give it to the psychopath that she had a profound effect on you. Everything you are accusing me of is directly from her playbook. 😉

  178. DarkHorseSD says:

    “LOL. What did she do? and what did the latest prospect tell you?”

    Where would I even attempt to begin on these two! It’s hard enough writing up the saga of a first date-cancelled second date snafu.

    I don’t have strong emotions because a lot of it is my fault letting it happen. But being damn clear in ones own mind not to try to go back serves a useful purpose.

  179. SunShineSD says:

    I never suggested they were “top notch.” I’m sure there are better ones out there; there’s just no way you’d be able to get them through a combination of selfishness in bed and low price.

    As for SB’s existing only in fiction, that’s your own specialty. I wish my last one existed only in fiction. LOL. Would have saved me quite a headache at times and a goodly chunk of change (>$50k). Can’t say I regret the whole experience though, strangely, but it is making me tighten up requirements.

  180. Josh says:

    For $3.50 I can buy (from Walmart of course. Screw Staples) a ream of printer paper and print “Peter Lugar Fillet Mignon” on it.

    That would be at least 500 fillet mignon for merely $3.50.

    Your “top notch” SBs exist in blog fiction. 😉

  181. SunShineSD says:

    LOL. What did she do? and what did the latest prospect tell you?

    BTW, I thought strong emotions towards a person just means not getting over the person yet. LOL.

  182. DarkHorseSD says:

    That’s why I’m sending money by PayPal to a woman I’ve never met. LoL!

  183. DarkHorseSD says:

    I also don’t want to find any more like that.

  184. DarkHorseSD says:

    I don’t want anything to do with that woman. I’m healthy enough not to want such a thing back.

  185. SunShineSD says:


    The type of package you offer has a huge impact on what kind of SB you get. If you go into a market offering only $3.50/lb for beef, chances are that you are not getting fillet mignon; ground chuck is most likely what you will get at the price point.

    If you offer only selfishness in bed (no oral) on top of low price, well darn, you might as well put out a sign that says “call me only when your rent is due.”

  186. Josh says:

    Differentiating cause from effect is a big challenge for many people. 😉

    The SBs calling me when rent was due was supposed to be a complaint from me and not something I proactively sought.

    And I sure will not have any chance with your SBs as they only exist in your blog fiction.

  187. Kms2014 says:

    Y’all….come on now..I joke around a lot, but no need to get serious arguing on here, right? (: it’s just a fun blog, right?

  188. SunShineSD says:

    Example of ass-making: “I KNOW my idea will work”

  189. Josh says:

    AssD = Doctor of Assumptionology

  190. SunShineSD says:

    The mothers will never have to worry about paying rent, so Josh’s chance with them is out of the window.

  191. SunShineSD says:

    LOL. Such ego from a man who probably never married, never had kids, and dubious in dealings with SB’s.

  192. Kms2014 says:

    There is something to think about…SunshineSD and his potential womb partner, and Josh, as their relationship therapist…hmm….(;

  193. Josh says:

    Get a chick involved. It will get interesting. That’s all. 😉

  194. SunShineSD says:

    Then don’t read them. It’s rather ironic a prolific poster of drivels such as yourself would complain about tired of reading the same thing over and over.

  195. Josh says:

    My friend I KNOW my idea will work, create stable families for the kids, and will generate money for me.

    I am just having good ole time of my life and have no interest in such heavy-duty undertaking at this time. Maybe in a few years when my libido slows down. 😉

  196. Josh says:

    I am tired of your posts talking about the same thing over and over and over, with minor twists.

    You should get a new womb in action. It will get interesting then. Thats all. 😉

  197. SunShineSD says:


    Agree, unless your idea involves you having arrangement with both the husband and the wife in order to strengthen their marriage, such discussion would indeed be irrelevant to an arrangement site.

  198. SunShineSD says:


    One has already done it: my ex-wife, having one baby with me, then “short-cutted” the system by adopting another after divorce, both with support from me.

    Today’s postings were addressing two issues that came up on the blog while I spent the weekend with the kids:

    1. how SD and SB feel about “betrayals” and counter-party failures;

    2. the realistic chance of sustained high allowance over long period of time.

    Not sure why you are so defensive when reading my posts.

  199. Josh says:

    If I had time, resources and–more importantly–interest in doing something in this arena, I would have worked towards helping strengthen the institution of marriage only for those couples who wished to raised kids. That would have created committed marriages by eliminating sabotage by women, would be scalable and would have generated a significant financial windfall for me.

    But since I am not interested in such undertaking, it remains an idea in my head, and I am not going to bore others with silly details. 😉

  200. Josh says:

    I am eager to witness the lucky wombs in action instead of repeated postings of why those wombs should get in action with this blogger.

  201. SunShineSD says:


    Thank you. My hope is that, by sharing some of my thoughts, some other SD’s will also give some consideration to similar undertaking.


    As much as I wish to help as many girls as possible, I like to operate with wide safety margins. That means currently I’m only estimating about a dozen spots available from me during my own life time, not 1001 spots. That means tight quality control.

  202. Midwest sugar daddy says:

    Sunshine has some really good points. He is trying to turn his sugar babies into positive impacts on society. He is looking at it as an investment for the right girl.

  203. Josh says:

    One womb in action is better than 1001 reason for a womb to want to be in action.

  204. SunShineSD says:

    Where in Wikipedia is the entry on how to set up an operation that will make the maintenance of of an SB almost self-financing? I’m shooting for the holy graille where the SB would have positive enterprise value, hence a real investment not just an expense item. That will automatically keep her allowance up even when the subjective value of the sex itself drops below the threshold of her time’s worth at legit jobs (like Euphoria’s experience seemed to have indicated).

  205. Kms2014 says:

    Wikipedia drama is back, lol!!

  206. SunShineSD says:

    IMHO, out-of-pocket high allowances are hard to sustain over long period of time due to diminishing return: the 100th time is just not worth as much subjectively as the first time, especially if the person is not especially creative in bed. Inventing drama does not earn brownie points as creativity.

    The median job pay in this country right now is only $27,500. Yet employers do pay some employees $50k or even over $100k. Why? Because those employees create even more value for the employers than their own pay. We who have sit on the other side of a job interview know the math involved in hiring decisions; high paying jobs are not handed out as charitable givings.

    There are certain types of positions where nepotism doesn’t matter but personal loyalty matters a lot! Those positions don’t even take much time dedication, but having someone loyal personal representative keeping an eye on things for a busy business owner would prevent “the shop” being given away or stolen. The enterprise I was setting up for my ex-SB would have produced $2-3Mil over 30 years at 2-5% inflation rate. I was willing to let her try her hand even after her pregnancy by someone else. She told me the pregnancy was accident (probably true) and she was not dating that guy and we would still be dating if I was willing. I was not naive enough to bank on that for long, but the math was simply that out of the $2-3Mil, even if they become couple due to all sorts of hormonal reasons later on and I would have to sell the enterprise to them, they’d still have $1.5-2.5Mil from the enterprise over 30 years. That would have recouped every cent I ever invested in her and the enterprise plus interest, and still leave them and the child with a fabulous start/re-start in life. Being a cautious person, I like to work with wide safety margins. Of course, it would only work if I had her loyalty, which proved not to be the case. Personal representative positions representing my interest at a table would only make sens when there is personal loyalty. LOL.

  207. SunShineSD says:

    *No, I don’t care about the “borrowed” money back. The point being she certainly did not feel contractual when borrowing them and asking for extra favors. LOL.

  208. SunShineSD says:

    Wow! Looks like I have missed some good fashioned bitching session for a weekend of soccer games and gymnastics recital, plus teaching the teenager some basic carpentry skills finishing up an outdoor shelter for cats.

    I really have no desire to see my ex-SB “rot in hell” or “burn in hell” per se. It was an open relationship, although I did not expect her to risk getting pregnant by someone else, or keeping such pregnancy from someone else. I don’t think she did anything particularly egregious along the chain of events, except for lying to me perhaps to make me feel better and make herself feel better, but over all the various decisions along the way added up to her lost opportunity, her loss. She did eventually offer to have an abortion, just before the state legal deadline was up, but it was too late from my perspective, especially because she had lied to me about the baby resulting from a one-night-stand during the New Years party, which would have put the gestation age one month earlier and therefore past the state deadline. Although physical options were still available by flying her overseas, I was not willing to brush up against the law or potentially risking the expecting baby daddy suing me for aggrieved loss; she did not tell me the baby daddy expected/wanted her to abort! LOL. What business did he have knocking her up to begin with! On top of that, due to the pre-natal paternity test having its limits, there was still a slight chance that the baby was mine, which would have been the best outcome for all concerned. Girls that age do weird things to justify their own actions, and try to make themselves feel better about themselves or look better in the eyes of others, without realizing how other people would react to the wrong information thus provided. What did piss me off, besides the frustration with lying from time to time, was her later invented justification that somehow she felt our relationship was contractual whereas her new one is not . . . hmm, if it was contractual, can I have all the money borrowed on top of the allowance but never paid back, paid back now as per contract? LOL.

    DarkHorse, I’d venture to guess that you’d rather prefer your ex-SB having herself delivered to you wrapped in a rolled up carpet, Cleopatra-style, in symbolic “total and unconditional surrender” (hey, it’s the D-Day weekend) and let you have your way with her, than having a corpse rotting or burning in hell. I fail to see how rotting or burning corpse in hell would be profitable for you. LOL.

  209. aliceS says:

    Midwest 🙂 that sounds great 🙂 wish you all the best. I discovered that since my account is shut down I am more happier than before 🙂

  210. Midwest Sugar Daddy says:

    @AliceS My sugar weekend was actually pretty good. After the last crash and burn with my old SB, some potentials were in the mix for me. I met a couple potentials last week and date 2 went really well with my new favorite.

    It looks like I am back in the game again. She is a very hot 21 year old student with a good personality and a great body. I will keep my radar up though, as we all know SB’s and SD’s are putting up a front, to a degree.

    She fits my criteria, which is young, student, very attractive, and fun. Who knows how long this ride will last, but so far, it has been fun.

  211. aliceS says:

    Shardz lol you should tell him I need it, cause of my aids issues 🙂 the next time he will definitely be cautious about sleeping around with strangers just like that 😉

  212. aliceS says:

    ▂ ▃ ▅ ▆ █ I have a Secret █ ▆ ▅ ▃ ▂

  213. aliceS says:

    Good evening all 🙂
    How was your sugar day 🙂

  214. Josh says:


    I guess that SD is not right for any SB who cares for her health. That’s not a norm. So block him and find a different SD.

  215. Josh says:


    I basically have stopped showing up on time for dates. There is just no way these girls in my neck of the woods would show up on time.

    This is what I do now. I plan to be 15-30 minutes late. At around 15 minutes before the date I would text her “how far are you?”

    More often than not they are either running late or “lost”. So based on the response I show up on “time.”

    No one has failed to show up yet but since I choose retaurants of my liking I just order whatever I love and surf the net. On occasion I have ordered food for them while they are on the way. 😉

    I am expecting at least one of the posses to habitually raise some kind of objection to my “strategy” and to equate me to a john or to accuse me of being a bottom-feeder, but I don’t give a shit. Never did, never will. LOL!

  216. DarkHorseSD says:

    Richard, why are you sitting there still waiting after 30 minutes? After 15 minutes?

  217. DarkHorseSD says:

    Elaine says, “If you want to be the mistress of such type of man, you know that it is always his schedule that comes first, and you just patiently adapt without making trouble.
    Because this is exactly one of the reasons why you are getting an allowance; to not claim or cause drama if dates are cancelled due to his schedule, as different from a regular GF.”

    Here’s another thing about this same girl I just mentioned with the first meet…we agreed to a second meet during the first, and shortly after on the way home I thought about it and decided to significantly upgrade the quality of what this second date would be, having been impressed with her.

    I had to cancel the second date, and she made a stink about it, but here is how it happened…

    On the way home I asked her with a “?” If a certain time frame would be possible because she had an important meeting, which I respected, and so estimated what was feasible knowing her transportation type. She did not respond to that last one, deciding apparently she would look at transportation schedule the day of the date.

    The next day I came down pretty sick and wrote her about it and how much I looked forward to our date. No response either.

    Two days later it is the morning of the date. I’m still pretty sick, and since his person who is “so caring” didn’t comment on my message from two days earlier either, I decided she must have vanished. I text her merely ‘ how are you’, considering the date unlikely in her mind. A few hours later she finally sends me a message that she cancelled her appointment to meet me…I now write her I am sick and can’t make it. That’s where she got testy.

    There was no need to cancel her appointment since I could have met later if the ? proposed time was too tight. But because she didn’t communicate in a reasonable fashion for two people who barely know each other, she went off and foolishly cancelled her important appointment unnecessarily on her own accord based on a need she invented in her mind.

    Then she tells me I shouldn’t do that to her. Blames me, etc. I’m sorry but I have no blame. Did I bend over backward to communicate more completely with someone that didn’t communicate at all? No. Should I? No. She makes her own mess.

  218. Josh says:


    I beg to disagree that showing up late has anything to do with cellphones per se.

    Showing up late is as old as when women decided to game dates. The most recent organized gaming has to do with Cosmopolitan, et al.

    If one doesn’t read Cosmo than she is influenced by one who does. 😉

  219. euphoria says:

    @josh- I really am to the point where I don’t care who knows about my sugar life anymore. There is really no way to hide the pictures with older men, new clothes, the vacations the 2 ex husbands and oh yeah, the news interview that I decided to do where they did such a poor job at bluing out my face that everyone who knows me texted me and commented on what a great interview it was. Eventually it all comes out in the open at some point. It is what it is, and I have really just stopped trying to make excuses for it.
    Now when I am at the dinner table with a sd and people ask about it… I just turn it around and tell them “Hes just into me for my money, and I am only dating him for his good looks.” It usually puts people in a lighter mood! People can talk all they want! But I am going to live my life the way I want to. I’m comfortable with it.

  220. DarkHorseSD says:

    EU says: “@DarkHorsesd- I actually saw my sd more then once per week. ” ……

    I would have liked all that a lot !!!

  221. SouthernSB says:

    Showing up late is more a generational thing that came along with the advent of cellphones.

  222. DarkHorseSD says:

    Elaine wrote: “And investing doesn’t mean asking to send money, or Herve Leger dresses, upfront to show he is “serious”.
    If you have take some time talking with him on line or by Skype, you will know soon enough if he is “serious”! ”

    That certainly wouldn’t be investing. I think it would be sabotaging. I think the thing about treating is if you want to have a hope of getting something good, you better treat the ones you meet that way until you find one that is good enough for that, and then stick with that one.

    On the other end, it is far easier and more likely to poison a situation and turn a good opportunity rotten than to take a good opportunity one into a long term relationship.

    In other words, evil is more damaging than good, so better keep the good up front.

  223. Josh says:


    I must say that I commend you on writing openly about your sugar reality. 😉

  224. Richard says:

    I’m constantly amazed how few SBs seem to realize how valuable their SD’s time is…assuming he’s actually successful! I would say about 90% of the time a potential SB has been late for a first meeting, and the average tardiness has probably been about 30 minutes or more. I don’t find that cute or endearing, nor does it somehow build anticipation, it just annoys me.

    I’ll overlook it the first time, and maybe even the second if she has other redeeming features (lol) but after that I find it unacceptable. My time is probably worth at least 50 times hers, but many women, especially beautiful women, seem to think men will just patiently wait. This behavior has likely been reinforced in their “normal” dating life.

    I have to say there is a correlation between how punctuality and age. The younger the woman the later they tend to be. Is it generational or just experience? Hmmm.

  225. euphoria says:

    @flyr- I believe that it is actually essential for a sb to make sure that the sd also takes care of himself. I actually had a sf sd off and on for a log period of time. He would spend a great deal of money making sure that I was well cared for and taking me on vacations. He donated to local charity’s and even made sure that I had dental insurance and paid for my wisdom tooth to be taken out when I came to him with a swollen jaw. I think he actually spent so much time taking care of everyone else that he forgot to take care of himself. I actually realized that is shoes had holes in them one day, so we went shopping for him. That was actually a very genuine and sincere sd/sb relationship.

  226. flyR says:

    “Cancelling dates in this case is to be avoided at all times, because it will be hard for him to recover this lost time.
    His time is money, and much more expensive as yours, so should always be respected.”

    Generally one of the reasons he is successful is that he keeps to his commitments. Occasionally there are true conflicts for both . A little reaching out to make it right goes a long way.

    I was reminded of the special things an SB may bring when I realized I was wearing one of several shirts a former SB bought for me. She had great taste and spent a lot of time looking for the right color / patterns for me.

  227. euphoria says:

    Its all said and done with now. I’m so over it. I’ve got a second date with a 26 year old finance guy who is really nerdy, extremely hot, he’s amazingly intelligent and is good in bed. He also doesn’t mind working around both of our extremely busy schedules to have a date. Sugar may be on hold for awhile. I’m going to explore this new opportunity. This goes to show that sd’s loss not mine!

  228. Elaine says:

    @ Flyr

    Completely agree on this of course!

    The typical SD is a busy and succefull businessman.
    Cancelling dates in this case is to be avoided at all times, because it will be hard for him to recover this lost time.
    His time is money, and much more expensive as yours, so should always be respected.

    If you want to be the mistress of such type of man, you know that it is always his schedule that comes first, and you just patiently adapt without making trouble.
    Because this is exactly one of the reasons why you are getting an allowance; to not claim or cause drama if dates are cancelled due to his schedule, as different from a regular GF.

    But in case an SD prefers P4P (which is not even a real allowance but a payment) he can expect trouble in case he cancels…
    Least he should do is make up for her lost time and salary in that case.

  229. flyR says:

    “I do agree that it is absolutely not correct to cancel meetings last minute, especially if SD knew you had to change shifts and it would cost you money!
    Like what happened to Alice and Texas some time ago, the SD’s should understand who is the SD here and NEVER cost a SB money! Being it transport, babysitter or missed salary…”

    I agree with the above but also point out it works both ways. Late cancellation by SB costs money or other opportunities. I’m sure I am not the only SD who has exited a relationship feeling , “she’s told one too many stories or is too unlucky for me to be with, either is disqualification.” I understand that stuff happens, especially with single mothers but when random becomes a pattern …..

  230. euphoria says:

    @DarkHorsesd- I actually saw my sd more then once per week. We would usually meet on the night of the arrangement and go to dinner. I would spend the night there and because I work mostly night shifts the day after, I would go straight to work after breakfast and wondering around with him running errands and stuff the next day. Then usually during the week, if I was lucky enough to get a break in the middle of the week, I would use the time to go run errands and meet my sd for lunch and just talk. The lunches were never paid dates and finances were rarely talked about over the course of the lunches. We had also made plans to go do other things together that I assume would have been unpaid and I would have taken my paid vacation at my job to be able to afford to go, but it would have taken alto of planning and sadly the sugarlationship as i call it, did not make it that long.

  231. Elaine says:

    “Sadly the hot kinky sex was probably better for him then it was for me”

    “After banging older guys for a few years, It was very nice to make the conversion back to a body type that I am extremely attracted to.”

    “His excuses for doing p4p was that the sb’s are so unreliable that he couldn’t trust them not to take the money and split”

    Was just not giving me the impression there was a mutual fondness, confidence or feelings.
    Sorry if I misunderstood.

    I do agree that it is absolutely not correct to cancel meetings last minute, especially if SD knew you had to change shifts and it would cost you money!
    Like what happened to Alice and Texas some time ago, the SD’s should understand who is the SD here and NEVER cost a SB money! Being it transport, babysitter or missed salary…

  232. euphoria says:

    @ Elaine- I actually have a slight difference in opinion. There were feelings for the said sd, yes! I mean, we talked off and on for about a year before we actually did meet. There were nice dinners and the conversation seemed to flow. I did confider him to be both a friend and a sd which is something that I really do care about. I also have former sd’s that I no longer have arrangements with and still call/text/Facebook status update and visit on a regular basis despite the fact that the arrangement just didn’t work out for one reason or another. This is part of the reason why I had to let that one go. To be around someone and make myself readily available for them on the most busy workday of the week and then be thrown on the back burner is just not cool. Maybe he treated me like an escort, but I defiantly do not treat my sd’s like I am a escort. The whole point is that if i trust someone enough to take time off of my job and take a cut in my pay, they should follow through and not treat me horribly.

  233. flyR says:

    @euphoria – appreciated your explanation.

    I think a lot of SB’s overlook the importance of offering something beyond just great sex with a younger woman. Part of the secret is looking inside for the other good things you bring to the table and then finding as SD who values that.

    The essence of marketing is differentiating your “product”. If it sounds abstract when you go to the market look at the salt. There’s Leslie and Morton and a store brand for 20% less. Salt is salt but branding adds value.

    Sadly the economy is not likely to improve for some time and more SB’s will be entering the market and probably some SD’s departing. I would look for quality and longevity and perhaps great sex that still lets you function the following day.

  234. JamieSB says:

    @ KMS
    Thank you.
    I do have the right attitude as I’m a fair and reasonable especially realistic, very down to earth person and I’m also very lucky as I have met some very amazing and interesting men : )
    Some people here have crazy expectation though in SA.
    Keep it real and classy I guess : )
    And keep my feet on the ground helps.

  235. euphoria says:

    @DarkHorseSD- Its not that Im not hot enough to make it worth my wild. Its just that I actually make more at my current job then most sd’d on this site can afford and refuse to give up my job to rely on a sd for obvious reasons! I’ve actually had some $3000-5000 per month and it worked great. At the time I was able to cut back some of my hours at work and still be able to have a social life too. But it takes someone extremely reliable to be able to do that with.

  236. Elaine says:

    @ Josh

    This has nothing to do with “blaming” or “problems”.
    It can easily be reversed too:

    ” Treat your man like a king and you will be the queen, treat him like a beggar and you will be the beggars wife”

    ” Treat your SD as a John and you will be treated like an escort….”

    Just ask yourselves, both SB AND SD!:
    “How come it is always ME getting all the pervs, Johns, flakes, escorts, runaways etc…

    I know I treat my SD as a king and I have, and have had, fantastic SD’s.
    Long term relationships based upon respect and genuine attraction with gentlemen I treated as such.

    Of course I have had my portion of flakes and poofers, though remarkable few pervs and still eagerly waiting for the first “Dick pick” to receive! LOL

    It is always a matter of action = reaction…

    Don’t expect to find an above average, high class SD with an average profile with average, ordinary or even tacky selfies.
    And if you get in contact with such SD you have to invest in the future relationship too.
    And investing doesn’t mean asking to send money, or Herve Leger dresses, upfront to show he is “serious”.
    If you have take some time talking with him on line or by Skype, you will know soon enough if he is “serious”!

  237. Kms2014 says:

    I meant….

    Also, can be turned around equally…..treat your SD like a ‘John’ and he will start treating you as an escort…or, better still, if he is a true SD, will replace you with someone whom actually wants more from him than an ATM machine, like FB’s avatar.

  238. flyR says:

    @Elaine “Sorry for those who delude themselves.
    Less age difference will make it more likely to find genuine mutual attraction.

    If there is no physical attraction from her side, what’s left?
    Exactly: MONEY!
    So it ends up to be a mere financial transaction.
    Again: fine if both parties agree with that.
    But then don’t be surprised if it will be treated as a financial transaction.
    That is the price you pay.”

    We seldom disagree but do on this in some respects. For a number of SB’s better a slightly aged SD than a vacuous brain. Probably the greatest example was Henry Kissinger, rumpled mid 70’s he was usually in the company of stunning young women with brains who found his combination of intellect, character and power irresistible. At the other end you have the much younger Bill Clinton who relentlessly pursued what carville referred to as trailer trash, and often by means of force.

    We do agree if there’s no physical attraction it’s not good.

  239. Kms2014 says:

    @Jaime…you seem to have the right attitude. It is not about ‘battle of the sexes’ or pitting men against women…it is about finding someone that you genuinely ‘like, are attracted to(both sexually, and emotinally)’, and who you view as much more than an ATM, and he views you as much more than a young vagina.

  240. Kms2014 says:

    “Josh says:
    June 8, 2014 at 8:37 am
    “@ KMS

    The saying is:

    “Treat her like a queen and you will be the king, treat her like a maid and you will be the maid’s man”

    I could add:
    “Treat her like an escort and you will be treated like a John….” ”

    Like I said earlier, every woman has an inalienable right the blame her problems to one man, a group of men or the entire MANkind. The “problems” ALWAYS seem to start from men.”

    @Josh, I don’t think that is what Elaine was trying to say..and it was NOT was I was trying to convey. I mentioned earlier, for the SB to find a SD that she generally liked, not one that would be treated as a ‘job’ or slightly better job option, so that she WANTS to spend time with him. How is that blaming men?

    Also, can be turned around equally…..treat your SD like a ‘John’ and he will start treating you as an escort…or, better still, if he is a true SD, will replace you with someone whom actually wants more from him than a SD.

  241. Kms2014 says:

    ‘Younger women have hooked up with older men for eons. As a matter of fact, the idea of dating/marrying almost the same age partner is a recent phenomenon. Men have always dated/married women much younger than them as a norm.’

    My grandma was 5 years older than my grandfather…my mother was a few years younger than father…but, do not think there was a trend of women being significantly younger than their husbands…maybe, if you mean after women were allowed more rights in society, were allowed to work, therefore had the option to be more picky… and were able to ‘choose’ a little more than before. I don’t think it was ever the ‘choice’ of a very young girl to marry a much older man, do you? It was most likely due to financial circumstances–once again.

  242. JamieSB says:

    I’m in my 20s and my last SD turned BF is 54 and he is the most attractive man I ever met ( bit like Richard Gere). He gets better looking when older!!!
    I treat my SD so well and often they treat me better as well.
    Requirements of Sugar I always apply:
    1/ Chemistry and Connection first priority
    2/ Respect, Honesty and Communication
    3/ Reliability
    They have worked real well for me so far. I’m not so good with a solid arrangement as it feels transactional but I let them spoil me and ask for their help if I need to.

  243. Josh says:

    “@ KMS

    The saying is:

    “Treat her like a queen and you will be the king, treat her like a maid and you will be the maid’s man”

    I could add:
    “Treat her like an escort and you will be treated like a John….” ”

    Like I said earlier, every woman has an inalienable right the blame her problems to one man, a group of men or the entire MANkind. The “problems” ALWAYS seem to start from men.

  244. Josh says:


    First of all, I appreciate a bunch of regulars exchanging ideas and sugar happenings without name calling. 😉

    @Elaine, the premise of dating “out of league” pretty much only applies when one is dating the other in a different social/economic class.

    Younger women have hooked up with older men for eons. As a matter of fact, the idea of dating/marrying almost the same age partner is a recent phenomenon. Men have always dated/married women much younger than them as a norm.

    Unfortunately for the longest time the attitude maintained on this blog was that of SBs doing a big favor to SDs by making themselves available to the otherwise undesirable SDs.

  245. Kms2014 says:

    Very good sayings, Elaine (:

  246. Elaine says:

    Forgot to add:

    e. Hungry bastard, watch your plate, let her always try from it first!

  247. DarkHorseSD says:

    Speaking of mental health problems, I’m beginning to suspect my schizophrenic personalities are identical twins.

  248. FatB'StardSA says:


    I am thinking “Have fun and find another one when it gets boring. Repeat until dead.” :-).

  249. Elaine says:

    @ FB

    I am not saying SD should choose older SB’s.
    I am just saying to not act surprised if a SB is not physically attracted to a SD 30 years or more her major.
    Sorry for those who delude themselves.
    Less age difference will make it more likely to find genuine mutual attraction.

    If there is no physical attraction from her side, what’s left?
    Exactly: MONEY!
    So it ends up to be a mere financial transaction.
    Again: fine if both parties agree with that.
    But then don’t be surprised if it will be treated as a financial transaction.
    That is the price you pay.

    @ KMS

    The saying is:

    “Treat her like a queen and you will be the king, treat her like a maid and you will be the maid’s man”

    I could add:
    “Treat her like an escort and you will be treated like a John….” 😉

  250. DarkHorseSD says:

    fATM: it comes down to my expectation I will probably end up treating her like a patient.

  251. Kms2014 says:

    Hehe, good one, Elaine….

    I would say, ‘B’…but, wonder what most SDs think?

  252. Kms2014 says:

    @fatbastard, you have not read all the older SB profiles, then….just like the average woman on SA, is more of the escortish type, from what I hear, I am sure the older ones are as well…but, not ALL..

    What happens if something is rare…whether it is old or new? Supply and demand….

  253. Elaine says:

    Another thing I am wondering from the first time I saw the pics on this topic:
    What are SD’s thinking, seeing those?

    a. Silly bastard, don’t you realise how stupid this looks?
    b. Poor bastard, she is only with you for your money.
    c. Stupid basterd, you really think she likes banging you?
    c. Lucky bastard, having such a hotty fall in love with you?

    And I would very much appreciate SB answers too!
    Could be an interesting and enlightening outcome… 🙂

  254. FatB'StardSA says:


    Most SD’s know what they are getting into using the SA site. Which is why most treat their SB’s in a certain way. Let’s not act like the older SB’s are any different though. I have read enough profiles to see that the MO is the same regardless of the SB’s age. Why would a SD choose an older SB over a younger SB in this case?

  255. Kms2014 says:

    Whats that saying someone else on blog mentioned before…’treat her like your maid and she will treat you like her employer’…or, something like that…

  256. FatB'StardSA says:


    If it comes down to her calculating a “rate” for her time with you then you can bet that you will become the boss who mistreats and underpays her. The flip side is also true though. Treat her like an employee and she will act like one.

  257. DarkHorseSD says:

    Shardz says:
    June 7, 2014 at 6:27 am
    “Hey guys, I am new to this and just wanted to ask a question. Firstly I would like to state that I am from the UK and find it extremely difficult to actually find a SD.

    Anyway, I was contacted by a SD and after a few days and a few emails he began to start a sexual conversation basically telling me what he likes and what I should be able to provide. After disclosing the fact that I will not have unprotected sex with anyone that I am in a NSA relationship with he decided to call me a looser and said that I was not for him.

    Now that was the first proper contact i have had with a SD but if this is what is expected, then I guess the site is not for me.

    I would like to hear what others have to say as I am sure this is not what is expected from any SB.”

    Oh no, you should expect much worse contacts from the SD side.

    Change your location to London, put on something mid-thigh from Bebe, and head in to town to watch the money roll in.

  258. Elaine says:

    I think Euphorbia made very clear how many SB’s think about their SD, yes…
    When you are an early 20, a 50y old body is “old” in your perception, and mostly not very attractive.

    But hey guys, isn’t that what most of you are here for, prepared to pay “allowances”?
    For dating far out of your league, at least age wise?
    Which is ok if both parties agree, but you cannot really be surprised then if you will be seen as a “job” or ATM machine…

    When I asked before how SD’s could enjoy sex with SB’s not attracted to them, I was told that this was part of the game, and it was not a problem if SB was not really enjoying the time together as long as she kept her part of the agreement.

    In Euphorbia’s case she was treated like an escort, and dumped her SD based upon the same calculations an escort would have made.
    But wasn’t this “arrangement” based upon this principle from the beginning?
    This is what happens in “arrangements” based upon a hot body and without any emotional involvement I am afraid.
    Both parties are completely and simply replaceable, and will be!

    Unfortunally this is the sort of “arrangements” strongly promoted by SA marketing.
    Young and desperate SB’s treated as escorts, treating their SD’s as Johns..

  259. DarkHorseSD says:

    One of my goals this week was to become literate in the use of PayPal for SA purposes and determine what anonymity is possible and other risks. In the end, I successfully transferred a sum of money to some girl I’ve chatted up with my bad jokes for months, but I haven’t gotten to meet yet. So yes there is a Santa Claus. Maybe not for Virginia but for the hope of future vagina.

  260. Kms2014 says:

    Yes, I must agree with this. In my opinion…think it is very sad, if an SB looks at her SD as a slightly better job alternative option. I want, and very much look forward to seeing mine…and talking to him. I thought this was the difference between being an SB and something else….you know, wanting to have a connection with the SD, and him wanting more with you, than only the physical….

  261. FatB'StardSA says:

    A SB making $500 per day at a job should work the 60 hours per week and forget about SA entirely unless she is actually interested in her SD.

  262. DarkHorseSD says:

    fATM, that’s true for certain types. I have an example of someone who I met just a week ago that explained to me how very nice and wonderful and giving she is, and all sort of other sweetness. And she seemed that way during the 3 hours we spent together.

    But, at the meeting and in texts, she has talked about two different bosses who mistreat and take advantage of her and grossly underpay her. This makes me expect that’s exactly what I will be facing during a relationship with her.

  263. FatB'StardSA says:

    The SB allowance calculations given by euphoria clearly illustrates why becoming emotionally attached to most SB’s is a bad strategy for SD’s. The SD is a second job. Most people do not like their jobs or boss and eventually the SB with this mindset will not like her SD either. People though I was an asshole when I mentioned that a SD should treat a SB like an employee. After reading many of the SB comments on the blog I think it is clear that this is the best approach to take.

  264. DarkHorseSD says:

    300/shift, 2 shifts per day, 30.5 days per month. $18,300/mo

    What else could there possibly be to consider?

    Euphoria I have to say you are a poster child for a type off SB I learned very early on to avoid. You make yourself sound a lot like one of those Russian/Ukrainian blood suckers I allowed myself to entertain for far too long. Fortunately for you, you have an extremely high paying job, and have zero need for an SD. You just need to do what comes so easily for you, bartending 112 hours per week.

  265. Kms2014 says:

    Also, as someone else mentioned earlier, I believe, if he was considerate, then he would have sent the allowance, regardless of your not meeting, since he had to cancel, last minute, for the second time in a row. An occasional cancel is normal, but not if you start to see a pattern. Perhaps, a counter argument to someone saying that an SB is on the lookout and leaves, when she finds someone who ‘pays’ more of her ‘rate’ is that some SD are always on the lookout for SB who will take less, then they cancel last minute, and end up not upholding their end of things, if they are on a pay per meet arrangement. There are two sides to everything….and the argument of allowance, I suppose.

    Anyway, Euphoria, if you do not like being given allowance, on a pay per meet basis, then there is nothing wrong with that. And would say that is quite normal, to prefer no actual money changing hands….Most SB prefer a transfer or some other form where the money is not seen, or ever spoken of again. It is nice to feel like someone is helping because they want to, not because they have spent X amount of time with you for that evening or day. You will know next time what to do, if someone tries to convince you otherwise. Good luck xx

  266. Kms2014 says:

    Their ‘rate’…perhaps, due to the attitude of ‘rates’ and whatnot might be the problem of some, in their plight. There are women, on SA, who do not want to be treated as if they were being paid a ‘rate’, much like another ‘profession’.

    Euphoria, my advice is to get a SD, whom you like and look forward to meeting. It might take a little longer, but if you are really wanting to see him, then it will not seem as much like a job, or slightly better job alternative. Also, the p4p or just a regular pay per meet option might work well for some, if both agree, but others never do want to get handed cash, at the end or beginning of the night….?it doesn’t sound like this was your preferred option, yet he insisted, due to past women ‘canceling’ on him. Punishing you for his past choices… It certainly doesn’t make many woman I know feel very good/ or warm and fuzzy to have cash handed to her after a date, like another profession(and escorts, at least, get cash before their dates, I assume)…why it is hard for certain men on SA to understand this, do not know. Perhaps, they are not good at picking out their SB, but why should you suffer, due to their past ‘bad experiences’ with SB canceling on him. Or, are there just so manly ‘escortish’ women on the site, that it ruins it for the rest of the women who are looking for something less transactional. Also, if canceling was such an issue for him, then he wouldn’t have cancelled on you twice. Sounds like he is the one who is the canceling type, who, if he was on SA during his ’emergency’ was also probably a liar and it is probably for the best that you ended it.

  267. DarkHorseSD says:

    What are some ways to get the word out to SDs that there are SBs in need in France so SDs can drop their local SBs in greed?

  268. DarkHorseSD says:

    I am deeply saddened to hear of the plight of women who are not hot enough to make it worthwhile for them to be SBs. However, revealing the calculations that go into the decision is a big step forward to ending the cycle of frustration and disappointment.

  269. DarkHorseSD says:

    “I am not sure why women think it will be easy to find a guy willing to drop $3K/month on a woman he sees once per week”

    Because SA markets a myth that you just make a profile and poof the money comes as of right. So you make a profile and Then you head home crying from your only meet in months of trying because your human right to a lucrative arrangement has been violated.

    ” Anything less and the SD will see the SB as disposable and drop her when a younger/better looking SB comes around”

    Yes, if you don’t deliver a good proposition you will get dropped. SBs have dropped me because they think they can get more elsewhere (once in a while they do.)

    Many women consider only the rate they got not their total profit over time. They value a $5,000/mo arrangement that lasted 6 weeks once in 3 years over a 2500/mo arrangement lasting 2 out of three years. The $5000 becomes their rate. Their self image. Their battle cry.

  270. euphoria says:

    If you don’t check? Then you should get checked! lol I think someone once told me that if it smells like fish, don’t trust it!

  271. euphoria says:

    @DarkHourseSd- I wouldn’t know! I’ve never shopped for hookers and I’ve never been one! If you figure it out let me know please! I’m curious!

  272. DarkHorseSD says:

    ” I don’t know if they are dirty “down there” because I never check,”

    Forget down there. I’d like to check SBs down under. Not sure how to get them up over for the check however.

  273. DarkHorseSD says:

    “would you elaborate how to find a “good” hooker and avoid a bad one.”

    You don’t. You find bad hookers until you find a good one.

  274. euphoria says:

    DarkHorseSD- Who said anything about getting out of anyone’s panties? I stood behind the bar all day today with a short black dress and no panties. It made life more interesting! Every time a customer complained to me, i just grinned and wondered what they would say if they knew my secret!

  275. DarkHorseSD says:

    It’s mid-day June 5 for me and I haven’t seen a single post about getting OUT of someone’s panties.

  276. euphoria says:

    Flyr- Its easy for me to justify sugar on economic ground based on the circumstances. I actually work a mix of nights and days and receive a salary plus any tips that I can manage to get from customers at work. Howeaver, if I am not working, then I am not reviving the tips that I would normally make and the salary is highly taxed which that alone is just not enough to pay off the current financial situation that I find myself in due to medical and legal expenses. So I really just cant afford to date and if I don’t have a sd than I am one of those people that needs to be at work 60-80 hours per week just to make it.

  277. Josh says:


    “For future reference the middle ground might be $1K twice a month.”

    I know it is squarely my fault, but I don’t know any man who communicates/speaks/writes like this.

    1. Are you a man?

    2. Do you date women?

  278. flyR says:


    For future reference the middle ground might be $1K twice a month. Dates cancelled early can be rescheduled but later no. It works both ways , if you are desperately needed elsewhere you can cancel but make it up.

    The second part of the middle ground is that after a few months it goes to a monthly allowance.

    If you have a night job and it pays reasonably well it’s likely to be tough to justify sugar on strictly economic ground. Thus your pursuit of the high allowance or someone you would date IRL makes more sense. Finally, hopefully there would be more than just dinner and decadence. If nothing else consider it your environmentalist streak in minimizing the numbers of batteries sent to landfills.

  279. Richard says:

    @Euphoria – Sorry to hear that. I guess you need to find an older guy who hasn’t let his body go. But they may be about as rare as older women who are in good shape. 🙁 Any deal can be renegotiated. You could have just said “well, apparently you’re the flaky one between the two of us, let’s do a monthly allowance.” At least as an alternative to ending things completely.

  280. euphoria says:

    @Richard- Sadly the hot kinky sex was probably better for him then it was for me. His excuses for doing p4p was that the sb’s are so unreliable that he couldn’t trust them not to take the money and split. So I said, ok sounds reasonable. Because he claimed he had had sb’s do it in the past. So in doing him the favor, I got screwed!

  281. euphoria says:

    The only upside to ending the arrangement of such a sour note is that because I was out the day of work, I actually got a chance to call back that really hot younger finance guy that was trying to take me out three weeks ago. After banging older guys for a few years, It was very nice to make the conversion back to a body type that I am extremely attracted to.

  282. Richard says:

    @Euphoria – Was the “hot kinky sex” good for you? I can’t argue with your financial calculations but it’s a bit strange you don’t consider a little lost sleep a small price to pay for sexual satisfaction. You also could have just asked for a monthly allowance rather than a per meeting allowance, which would have solved all your issues. If he cancels at the last minute it’s his loss. 🙂

  283. Josh says:


    I don’t blame you at all for that dear. 😉

  284. euphoria says:

    @josh, Nope… I’m tired after sex, my ideal day after a night of kinky hot sex is just laying in bed or a lawn chair all day and ordering takeout or being made breakfast. I defiantly don’t want to be at work the next morning.

  285. Josh says:

    “Plus i am at work the next day to tired to think strait from all the hot kinky sex i was up having the night before.”

    Most men would be highly productive the next day. 😉

  286. Josh says:


    “As a general rule, you can’t make your problem the other person’s.”

    Every woman has an inalienable right to blame her problem(s) on one man, a group of men or the whole MANkind.

    The most convenient blamee is the man who is already engaged or is seeking to engage with her vagina. 😉

  287. euphoria says:

    Just dumped a sd. The reason.
    A. I cant afford to date. This is why arrangements are good for me. It only compensates for what I would be making in a night of work pulse a little extra. About $200 extra seeing as how I am a dam good and hot bartender and make $300 per shift at my job.
    B. I set up an arrangement with the understanding that I could meet once a week and take that night off of my well paid job to go on the date.
    C. The dates were cancelled twice in a months time period with less then 24 hours notice, so now im loosing the $500 per night that my sd would have given me. But I also cant pick up a shift in time to fill the new void on one of the most busy nights for me to work. So by being cancelled on twice and only taking $1000 instead of the $2000 I was hoping for, Its really not worth my time.
    C. For me, just going to work both nights that I was cancelled on would have added up to $600 for the month and just going to work the 4 nights that I was supposed to have that arrangement means at least $1200 per month in my pocket. Which means if i am cancelled on twice in one month, it means that im loosing $200 for the two shifts that I would have normally taken with if I did not have plans with the sd.
    D. If he actually does show up for all 4 dates at $2000 per month, I am only making $800 per month more then my job would pay me anyways. Plus i am at work the next day to tired to think strait from all the hot kinky sex i was up having the night before. So now, I am tired… Cranky at work and taking a dip in my tips the next day just to go on a date with the sd.
    So my conclusion is that unless a sd wants to give me at least 3000-5000 per month allowance up front weather or not he makes it to the date. I don’t have the time or the money to put up with it. Then the sd does not get why i am so mad that he cancelled on me? I don’t like begging my boss for extra hours a the last minute and sounding that needy at work. So its better for me to just show up for my shift and take the potential $800 per month loss by not having a unstable arrangement.
    Im not trying to be a b*tch but also, both times before I was cancelled on, I also hopped on sa and saw the log in dates of the former sd’s profile. He was online the day before I was cancelled on both nights. This leads me to believe that it wasn’t actually an emergency cancellation as he stated and that he happened to be online and found a more convenient date for the night, and if thats the case, its not cool to make me have to suffer financially to spend time with some other sb. It seems like just ending it completely so that I could scedule more hours at work and move on would have been the way to go about it.

  288. DarkHorseSD says:

    Correcting some errant advice seen on June 3:

    “A serious SD will let you pick the place for the first meeting.” Not so. Not a necessary or sufficient condition for serious sd status.

    The parties are generally responsible for getting themselves to a first meeting…several paragraphs can be written on the permutations of circumstances leading to what is agreed about that. As a general rule, you can’t make your problem the other person’s.

    Crying on the way home because after several months no sd has been landed…I need to read further into June to see what needs to be said on this.

  289. Kms2014 says:

    If you do make a lot, and are US citizen earning money abroad….it is pretty bad. Why some high earners, in Europe, do not want a US citizenship, if they have opportunity, lol.

  290. flyR says:

    “”In France you need to find a SD who does not need to work for a living.”” My sense is that the state of the French economy is such that a) the SD is probably working and b) the supply of SB’s is high. My guess is that there is a lot of informal sugar and intellectual sugar flowing around Paris.

  291. Kms2014 says:

    Well, I was assuming(hoping) there was another source of income, in earlier scenario, anyways. With that being said, SB surely do not report, but according to Alice, awhile back the French government was giving those on the site a little ‘scare’, in that they were threatening to investigate those in site, and to look into any unexplainable transfers….

    The US isn’t very nice, when you are a citizen and work overseas, either. They are the worst about taxing those who make money abroad with their worldwide tax. There is only one other country who does this(Eritrea). I didn’t do this, when I worked overseas…eheh! Hope the IRS isn’t watching blog 😉 could be fined $10,000, from what I heard…I’m just teasing. Did not make enough to be taxed, anyway, hehe.

  292. Kms2014 says:

    Well, I meant due to their other source of income being taxed…Not the allowance portion 😉 So, $3,000 there would be a lot less then, say, $3,000, in Little Rock, Arkansas or some other relative place, or even in small town US, where cost of living would be lower. And yes, especially, if you have children…

  293. FatB'StardSA says:


    “Considering tax rates and cost if living, $3,000 USD is not very much, in France.” I don’t think many SB’s are claiming their allowance as income do you? The high tax rate actually explains why it is very difficult to find a SD in France who has $3K month to spend on a SB. In the USA $3K/month would be the limit for a SD with a high paying job. In France you need to find a SD who does not need to work for a living.

    Zurich is very expensive but it is absolutely possible to live there for less than $5K/month. Raising a family on that much would be a different story.

  294. DarkHorseSD says:

    Ok, I’ve just read two days worth to the point four days ago when SunshineSD agreed to make multiple babies through multiple simultaneous and serial nonogamous (not a typo) relationships.

    I can’t wait to read on after I post this…

    “SunShineSD says:
    June 2, 2014 at 10:57 am
    @Southern @KMS

    I was not complaining. I was responding to a post by MidWest, where he seemed to have a moment of glee over his ex-SB facing hardship after breaking up. It’s an understandable emotion after being hurt.”

    I struggle between wanting mine to rot in hell and burn in hell. How does one choose?

  295. Kms2014 says:

    Of course, could be worse….Switzerland is very expensive :-/ Would have to set your monthly allowance to at least $10,000 USD, ehehe!

  296. Kms2014 says:

    Considering tax rates and cost if living, $3,000 USD is not very much, in France. Also, in London and Paris, there are quite a few businessmen , in and around that area, or there occasionally, due to business travel as well… or, high net individuals who can afford that allowance amount…and much more. It is just getting them interested, or justifying spending their limited time with you.

    If the only value you are putting on a SB relationship, is beauty and age, then yes, the SB is very disposable and can be replaced very easily with another hot body. If you seek something more, then the relationship is not as disposable. I think you made a very good point before, FB, regarding what else someone brings to the table besides their looks….

  297. FatB'StardSA says:


    The people who claim you have no life are quite possessive about this blog. It’s like the blog is their only way of interacting with others (at least about SB/SD relationships).


    Sorry about you bad luck finding a SD, I think your location does not help your case, especially considering your allowance range. That said, I am not sure why women think it will be easy to find a guy willing to drop $3K/month on a woman he sees once per week. Look at the SB’s written about in the article. These were full time SB/SD relationships. Even gtt_envy expects a lot of communication between meets by texting every day. Anything less and the SD will see the SB as disposable and drop her when a younger/better looking SB comes around.

  298. Josh says:


    “The guy posts a lot”

    True. Guilty as charged…

    “and jerks off watching internet porn”

    Negative on that. THAT’s another fiction created by one of the posses close to the psychopathic blogger. They even invented my membership in a website that I had no knowledge of before the invention of the membership. I even forgot the name of the site.

    For the record, I have not jerked off for months watching internet porn or in any other setting. Regular sex is plentiful and life is as good as it can be in that department.

    I don’t write much about myself because any amount of data was/is good enough for the psychopath and her posses to invent fiction about me.

    “Why the fuck are you people obsessed with Josh?”

    Exactly! THAT’s a million dollar question…Why why why? LOL!

  299. Jj says:

    @Euphoria, should he be a real and proper Daddy, he would most definitely maintain the allowance for his cancellation, due to no fault of Baby; however the reverse be true…… yk. just say’n…. welcome 42,,great input…. back to the rafters….

  300. FatB'StardSA says:

    For the record, I am the guy who stated that I refuse to give my SB’s oral sex. I don’t know if they are dirty “down there” because I never check, and I never will.

  301. FatB'StardSA says:

    We need less of Josh on the blog and more posts by FlyR, Richard, Zack, PriceySpicey…sorry I could not keep writing that without laughing my guts out.

    Why the fuck are you people obsessed with Josh? The guy posts a lot and jerks off watching internet porn (if that were a crime I would be sentenced to life imprisonment), sounds like a typical blogger to me.

  302. Shardz says:

    Hey guys, I am new to this and just wanted to ask a question. Firstly I would like to state that I am from the UK and find it extremely difficult to actually find a SD.

    Anyway, I was contacted by a SD and after a few days and a few emails he began to start a sexual conversation basically telling me what he likes and what I should be able to provide. After disclosing the fact that I will not have unprotected sex with anyone that I am in a NSA relationship with he decided to call me a looser and said that I was not for him.

    Now that was the first proper contact i have had with a SD but if this is what is expected, then I guess the site is not for me.

    I would like to hear what others have to say as I am sure this is not what is expected from any SB.

  303. Josh says:


    “you are probably better off finding a good hooker or a real girlfriend.”

    Well, personally due to lack of experience in this area, I am not able to differentiate between a good hooker and a bad hooker. So would you elaborate how to find a “good” hooker and avoid a bad one.


    But it would at least demonstrate that you actually know what you write about. 😉

  304. Josh says:


    Implied by?

  305. KatPaw says:

    @ Josh

    You may have not used the word dirty.. Yet it has been majorly implied..

  306. Josh says:


    ‘The perception that the women you are seeking are “dirty”.’

    Show me one post from me where I have even hinted that women are “dirty”.

    I have NEVER portrayed women as “dirty”. However, one of your favorite and psychopathic bloggers blogger ivented that accusation and you and her well-wishers mindlessly found that accusation conducive to help boot me off the blog.

    So come up with something that I have actually said and NOT fiction invented by a psychopath who wanted me off the blog from day one.

  307. flyR says:

    Josh – I took a moment to reflect on some of your many comments over the past 40 days and a common thread jumped out

    The perception that the women you are seeking are “dirty”.

    The almost humorous reference to “down there” which I don’t recall hearing since I left the sandbox.

    My guess is that you have a bifurcated vision of women as being divided between the unattainable on pedestals and the polluted fallen women. It’s like thinking you should live on tofu or chocolate.

    I sense a feeling that the women here are just waiting to steal your money and deny you pleasure. Yes there are some who are looking to do the very minimum for the maximum amount of cash and have feelings of entitlement (GPS) or anger. But they are probably the minority.

    In my search for SB’s over the years (starting before there was SA) I came to realize that it was important to me that the sex was no different from that of a committed, carnivorous relationship. In today’s world there are risks, but, those risks can be substantially mitigated with a little politically incorrect, but wise discrimination and finding those with similar attitudes.

    I have been fortunate to have had relationships with some amazing SB’s both through SA and IRL. A number remain friends although my “deal” with those who have been in grad school has been that it ends when they graduate as it is time for them to launch a new life. Of course if they want to return after a few years that’s wonderful. I have learned to recognize those who might be perfect for someone else but who are not a match for me.

    SA is a big tent. My guess is that you’ll be happier if you focus your search on women who you see as equals or perhaps something to reach for. That however brings with it the need for you to be worthy of the relationship in ways beyond just the sugar.

    Hopefully you’ll think about this for 48 hours before replying.

    My suggestion for Josh is that you think carefully about your feelings towards the women of SA. If you look at them as fallen women and a threat to your health and wallet, you are probably better off finding a good hooker or a real girlfriend.

  308. flyR says:

    Probability of million dollar SB somewhere in the universe is about the same as the probability that the sun will rise in the AM. Needless to say the median is a tiny fraction of that.

  309. Zack says:

    Good luck, Kat and Krew.

  310. Josh says:

    Rhetorical question: What are the odds of an SB hearing about a potential arrangement worth millions of dollars in the next 20-30 years?

    Rhetorical question: What are the odds of an SB actually landing an arrangement worthless millions of dollars in the next 20-30 years?

  311. Josh says:

    Rhetorical question: What are the odds of an SB actually landing an arrangement worth millions of dollars in the next 20-30 years?

    Rhetorical question: What are the odds of an SB hearing about a potential arrangement worth millions of dollars in the next 20-30 years?

  312. aliceS says:

    Hello there infidels 🙂

  313. KatPaw says:

    Hope everyone has a sugar filled weekend!!

  314. SunShineSD says:


    The typical basketball player makes very little money (I believe the median income of high school basketball player sticking with basketball for career is in the sub-$20k/yr range 15-20years later, whereas the high school basketball players switching to other careers make nearly double). The NBA players are statistical anomalies. Likewise, the typical CEO is the founder of one of hundreds thousands to millions of small business; while he does tend to make decent upper-middle class living, it is not the millions per year that the news media bandies about Fortune500 corporations, which are 500 largest (publicly traded) out of more than 500,000 businesses out there. I agree with you regarding some Fortune500 CEO’s, nepotism and political appointees do exist in huge organizations like that. They are essentially bureaucrats.

    In any case, I think what flyR was trying to say was not which jobs deserve the pay, but for a youngster deciding on a career, the more mundane and productive careers actually have far better odds than the extremely long-shot stardom careers.

  315. SunShineSD says:

    @Kat @flyR

    Thank you. Life is a game of odds. The ability to assess those odds and act accordingly is a critically important skill. The media’s tendency to focus on whats sensational and unusual (their need to get eyeball time) is not helping the viewers develop a realistic view of the odds in life: man biting dog story becomes news whereas the far more common dog biting man story doesn’t get covered; for someone not familiar with dogs and men in real life, the statistical odds assessment get very warped from having the ersatz life piped in via the tube.

  316. FatB'StardSA says:

    “Sadly we are a society that worships the basketball player who practices his three pointer a couple hours a day, the musician who plays hour after hour, but holds in disdain those who seek knowledge in the library or working as an apprentice or intern.”

    A basketball player has a measurable skill (number of points per game, etc.) and gets paid based on performance, less so for the musician although technical ability on the instrument can be recognized. These people should be appreciated. If you think you can do a better job than them grab a basketball or pick up an instrument and show everyone how it is done. Business executives on the other hand are often given positions due to nepotism and the ability to lie, and get bonuses (and government bailouts) even when running their companies into bankruptcy. It is harder to justify the salary of a typical CEO than the salary of a typical basketball player.

  317. JamieSB says:

    Hope everyone has a great week full of sugar!!

  318. flyR says:

    Just to be clear, I really applaud Sunshine’s desire to increase the depth of the gene pool through his personal commitment. Unfortunately, in too many areas of American culture we have reversed the process of evolution.

    While I sill believe in the value of the nuclear family, I applaud the Sunshire Farm as a health alternative to the “village”.

  319. flyR says:

    @ Sunshine “When there is nobody offering them better opportunities, government welfare programs are very tempting to get on and get by on.”

    I think the problem is not the lack of “somebody” offering a better alternative, but rather our culture faliling illuminating the many pathways available and celebrating failure and victimization.

    Sadly we are a society that worships the basketball player who practices his three pointer a couple hours a day, the musician who plays hour after hour, but holds in disdain those who seek knowledge in the library or working as an apprentice or intern. Out in the real world the odds of a highschool player making the NBA are probably 10,000:1. However, the odds of a reasonably competent person making a good living through a great work ethic are probably 2:1 or better.

    For SD’s the good news is that society buys into the woe is us and that provides an ever expanding pool of nubile SB’s, convinced that we are the path to the promised land. ….. and we are only too willing to cultivate the fertile fields.

  320. Eloquence says:

    Katpaw if you move to NC you will be near me!!! 45 min to an hour. I suspect…. If I can help, please email me 🙂

  321. Eloquence says:

    oh I can be crude/rude/and linguistically creative, but ive provided bare mineral simplistics. 🙂

  322. Eloquence says:

    @ Euphoria

    Can I be flat out crude – I want to get laid soooo good so badly I forget my name… its a blog right….tada… say yes?

  323. Eloquence says:

    @ ohhh we are all the something…. for gold, rust, for diamond or dust… as the song goes….

    I would ride a cowboy versus a horse any day so as to beg for salvation 🙂
    Tears forced into my own eyes at my past mistakes to look clearly to see the tall form of my old friend.
    “May I too bid you welcome and that I too rejoice to have such a good neighbor” …… “What a dinner we shall have at the prodigal’s hour”

  324. euphoria says:

    I hate it when a sd cancels our plans on me the night before we are supposed to go out. Ugh, please let your sd know a few days in advance and be considerate so that she can schedule a double shift at her job and make up for the money shes loosing when you cancel your date.

  325. KatPaw says:


    As far as I could tell Sunshine was only slamming on your arrangements being “john”like. And from your own comments on how you use SA and the “SBs” you tell about you sound like a John.. It would be nice if you could play nice with others.. Yes friendly debate is all good but you attack people.. Makes for the blog to be an unpleasant place at times.. As the saying goes ” if you don’t have something nice to say; say nothing at all”


    Some of us intelligent women and I’d say mothers see the validity of your “project”
    Plus I think it absolut BS that and prospective mothers would have trouble finding a life partner just because of having a child with you.

  326. SunShineSD says:

    You got the basic idea correct. In addition to the agreement between the two parents, the child support amount would be in a court order, the violation of which would land me in a jail! I’m not planning on dying any time soon though, so please don’t count on a windfall from my death 😉 I’m planning to stick around and provide the support network for the next few decades. If something unfortunate happens to me, there will be sufficient assets in trusts to serve all the mothers and children.

  327. SunShineSD says:


    Where did I come around and criticize everyone else’ arrangement? You started picking on mine before I started picking on yours.

    My ex-wife was the accidental prototype that gave me the idea: she had a baby with me while still married, and our co-parenting arrangement after divorce is turning out happier for all three of us than it was during the marriage; we get long so well platonicly that we essentially adopted a kid together several years after divorcing each other. I’m voluntarily paying her multiple times the court ordered amount, and still have rapidly growing resources for more instances of the same kind of arrangement. Seems to be a far better solution for the second half of my life than marrying again . . . would also avoid the real “baby farm” scenario of me and my ex-wife adopting many children. She wants to adopt more all right, but I have misgivings about raising too many children in a group family.

    After being on SA for a while, it should be clear that many young women are poor not because of lacking intelligence or weak-mindedness, but simply because of the curse of generational poverty. They were born into poverty, and they never had the opportunity to apply their raw intelligence and drive to legal and highly profitable enterprises. If they get pregnant by someone just like themselves before establishing good careers, the cycle continues. When there is nobody offering them better opportunities, government welfare programs are very tempting to get on and get by on. That unfortunately has severe long term adverse consequences due to the programs’ effective prohibition on capital accumulation. Someone has to give them the opportunities to break the cycle.

  328. aliceS says:

    I’m saying hypothetically. If I could pick up someone with serious capital and idea about his kids, and I would be sure he wouldn’t bother me to do my job as a mother. He’ll yeah I’m agree. But I would seriously discourage him to try to scam someone like this in even small things or it might go ballistic later. If she felt threatened to loose her status it would make worldwide headlines 😉

  329. Josh says:


    ANY project with millions of dollars in seed capital will have a good start.

    The proof of the pudding is in the eating. So unless a woman takes him up for real, its all BS.

  330. aliceS says:

    Sorry for typos, my phone is crazy and I can’t see well cause it’s late in here 😉

  331. aliceS says:

    Josh I think intelligent women would pick up sunshine farm as I may call it. The first reason, if it was written black on white that till his death he will provide and take care of his children with X amount per month. That he guarantee the best college and university scholarship for his child. And that he will be there as well when needed, you need to be someone really retarded to pick up another guy to have a child with. And if after his death his child inherited his goods and etc. Even better. Smart women would use it as a huge plus. Plus after all, when all the financial things are resolved due to the baby and mother as he said, than mother might be smart enough to use some of it to create her own similar incomes. In that case both parties become independent, but female and child in case of mother business failure are still protected by sunshine providing. Am I reading it right?

  332. SunShineSD says:

    Thank you. LOL. A gentleman’s hobby homestead “farm” set on a few acres near the ocean perhaps, definitely not the factory farms. More like A garden, a flower patch, or a nursery inside a protective greenhouse cover keeping out the harsher elements.

  333. Josh says:

    There’s nothing wrong with any arrangement. However when one comes around and professes everyone else’s arrangement as various forms of prostitution, then it is natural to ask, show me the womb in action with suche “grande” idea.

    He has none…

    First he married a not so fertile woman only to divorce her and the next womb he tried to acquire went for a very man he abhors.

    So multiple failures in real life do not qualify him to lecture SBs and SDs who are minding their own business trying to make the best of the sugar world.

    Also, he keeps on harping that he wants intelligent, strong-minded women, but his real target is the women who are candidates for government welfare programs.

  334. SunShineSD says:

    @Alice @Kat

    Thank you ladies for your endorsement of my idea. That was very kind of you both.

  335. Eloquence says:

    lets see.. my mother was 98 pds when she had me at 40 yrs old and as far as I can tell, I turned out normal (depends on who you might ask though).

    Plus, I am not a spring chicken either for I chose the summer instead 🙂 Aren’t we all running against time anyways?

    I would of chosen Sunshine’s “farm” prior just as Alice mentioned.. (Yes, Sunshine I am aware you never professed a farm, but grande idea non-the less, eh?)

    However, when I found myself alone in the garden as was such in days gone by… I looked on myself silent, though my tongue burned me, until one gentleman thinking I neglected, whistled: “Love Runs Out” OneRepublicVevo.

  336. aliceS says:

    Josh I hate waiting. So I would simply tried to be the first pregnant, or one of the first 😉

  337. KatPaw says:

    I’m kinda with alice on this one too.. If both parties are adults and agree then wtf are others concerned.. Plus I do see merit to Sunshines idea.. And probably about 10 years ago I would have taken him up on such an offer too. Being a single mother can be hard but it’s extreme hardship when you have no other support..

  338. Josh says:


    Hmmm, I am curious…why would you pay him and for what?

  339. aliceS says:

    Sunshine Can I be impregnated as well? Or I’m way too old for you 😉
    But seriously, If both parties are agreed, than i don’t get what are we arguing about. Honestly, if i new 10 years ago about my fucked up ex hubby and had a choice of joining sunshine’s farm. I’d pick a farm and even would consider paying him if needed. Seriously

  340. KatPaw says:

    I sure hope there are some more/better SD options once I’m in that area..


    Nothing is positive yet but a very very good probable!

  341. SunShineSD says:


    Congrats! NC has a lot of interesting people in fast growing sectors of the economy.

    BTW, did anyone notice NCGent lately?

  342. Kms2014 says:

    That is a great city, katpaw (: Love Charlotte and Asheville (((:

  343. Josh says:


    There you go literally. 🙂

    I bet you will find more action there…

  344. KatPaw says:

    Ok on a different note…. Looks like I have a State for moving destination in next couple months.. NC! Looking probably around Charlotte area..

  345. Josh says:


    This is what I would like to hear about. A real womb in action. Everything else is pretty much mindfuck as none of us seems to be interested in your “gameplan” per se. 😉

  346. SunShineSD says:

    If you got her into a conventional relationship by promising prospect of “traditional marriage,” going back to sugarship will be difficult. You will essentially have wasted her time, and owe her back pay.

  347. Kms2014 says:

    @42SWM…I am not sure about that. Have never had that happen. I suppose, it could be possible, depending on the woman and the man, and if the real dating relationship ended on good terms? If the man wanted to go back to the previous arrangement, and the woman was okay with it, then I so not see a reason why not? Unless, she/ he was hoping for something more, and now will not settle for less?….I have no experience at all with this type of dynamic.

  348. SunShineSD says:


    Are you talking to me or someone in your own fantasy? I already addressed almost all of you latest attack points in my earlier posts. I’m attending little league games, dance recitals and organizing trips now! Are you?

    Where did you get the idea of reducing fatherhood to financial assistance even before I turn 60? The average working man has to work 40hr/wk jobs plus commute until 65. I can work 20hr/wk now if I wish (or 80hrs if I want to work) and do not need to commute except for going to visit children. Heck I can retire now if I don’t plan on having more children than I already have. I will quit working at 60, as that will be the best use of my time to ensure there will be plenty resources for all the kids and the mothers.

    Where did you get the idea that I would preclude the women from marrying someone else? One of the main reasons for maintaining separate households, at significant additional cost to myself, is to give each woman freedom to date others after giving birth to my child. Stop putting your own harem fantasy on me. No harem, no baby farm, and no baby factory. The average woman has 2.2 children just to keep the population stable. I’m only asking for one child from each and in return she essentially gets a trust fund of her own and her child, putting her on even footing with other women born into much more fortunate circumstances. After that, it’s up to her to make the most of the resources that I provide, whether it be a productive career or a “traditional husband” to have the other 1.2 children or more is entirely up to her. She will only be in her late 20’s to early 30’s, so still plenty time to get married and have more children if that’s her thing, and she will be husband shopping in much better circumstances.

  349. 42SWM says:

    KMS, yes that is what I meant. I think it is not unusual for a SD/SB arrangement to transform into a conventional BF/GF relationship, but if it does, is it reversible? Obviously people can agree to anything they want, but as a practical matter, is such an effort doomed to fail?

  350. Kms2014 says:

    ” Anyway, in terms of a new topic, how about the risks and viability of transforming a SD/SB arrangement into a more conventional dating? Is such a transformation reversible?”

    @42, do you mean, if the SD/SB relationship ends up turning into a real type dating scenario…then, is it realistic, to then turn it back into an arrangement, if so desired? Forgive me, think I might be reading it wrong…

  351. 42SWM says:

    Reducing fatherhood to financial assistance and maybe some mentoring when they get older is creepy, sad, and ultimately less than optimal in terms of efficacy. When you have your group of kids, will you attend little league games, dance recitals, organize trips to the zoo, etc.?

    Are those things you will do right away? On a consistent basis? Or just after you turn 60? Kids of course are just computers that you can reboot anytime you want. They won’t wonder where their father is, why he isn’t around, etc?

    A woman who has kids with you in this manner might be better off economically than otherwise, but having a child with you may also preclude finding a more traditional father/husband.

    There are worse things in this world than being economically disadvantaged.

    Using money to shape a mutually beneficial relationship with an adult SB is a different thing that planning for purposely creating multiple human beings who will not have a father in the home. That kind of sugar daddy is harmful—kids need far more than money.

  352. SunShineSD says:


    Where did read I would ignore the kids before 60? 60 is when I will quit working on businesses and quit making more babies (and the dating activities that would entail), and focus on the kids that I will have by then.

    Not used to having time table regarding baby making? Have you ever thought about how a woman thinks? Ever heard of her biological clock ticking? I’m starting to realize why you are 42 and single. I had previously assumed you were divorced like I am.

    “Any plan that provides for intentionally having many children with multiple women is an infringement of basic human dignity.”

    It’s better than accidentally having many children with multiple women, for both the women and especially the children. Don’t worry, it’s not what you think. I’m not planning on keeping multiple women to myself, if that’s what you are thinking. Serial monogamy (and possibly co-parenting contracts with especially competent women that does not even involve dating).

    Interesting you brought up the topic of transforming a sugar relationship to a conventional dating relationship. You can ask her if she would consider having a baby with you; her answer, yes or no, is the answer with that particular SB.

  353. SunShineSD says:

    FYI, I dated a professor over 35 when I was in college, when I was only 20. I’m just in a different phase of my life right now.

  354. SunShineSD says:


    When I’m done with making babies, I will have plenty time dating older women. “Ageism?” Does discrimination even apply when talking about with whom one would have sex with? Do I have to host a UN meeting in my bed? LOL. I don’t remember selling tickets to the public.

    Regarding genetic disease risk, no I probably would not insist on aborting but the final decision would be up to the mother. The idea here is to give the mother a brighter future along with her child, not to burden her with a child that requires substantially more time and effort than usual. That’s why I prefer avoiding congenital diseases.

  355. 42SWM says:

    SunShineSD says:
    June 2, 2014 at 10:57 am
    @Southern @KMS

    “I intend to focus on the kids after turning 60, so all the kids will have graduated college and have started a career when I pass from this world. Consequently, I have this 20yr window right now to produce enough kids to keep me occupied after I turn 60.”

    It is true that SunShineSD did not use the words “harvest” or “farm” in describing his plan. However, the language above is very analogous to the language of planting seeds for future use.

    It is one thing for SDs and SBs to use each other in mutually beneficial ways. Purposefully having babies that you largely ignore until after you turn 60 is treating kids like an clothing accessory or an item or entertainment. Babies are human beings deserving of their own dignity, and they don’t have the ability to consent to lesser treatment. I believe that SD/SB relationships work best when individual human dignity is respected. In some instances, an adult may require less than such respect, and that is their decision to make (some adults may even crave such treatment). Any plan that provides for intentionally having many children with multiple women is an infringement of basic human dignity. The fact the plan is all about the man’s time table, have as many kids as possible until turning 60, and then focus on the kids that you have is in my view analogous to harvesting children from a baby farm. Anyway, in terms of a new topic, how about the risks and viability of transforming a SD/SB arrangement into a more conventional dating? Is such a transformation reversible?

  356. Kms2014 says:

    Anyway, moving on…perhaps, now we can drop the crazy fake baby harvesting talk and move on to more interesting and positive subject matter. Like real-world SA type things….

  357. Kms2014 says:

    Am I bitter? I didn’t feel very bitter, when I had not one, but three SD, in past, who were younger than me. One, by almost ten years! Hehehe! You probably are the type who would never believe such a thing, and would never see the ‘value’ in ‘paying’ a woman over 35, since, well….that is just ridiculous to someone like you, since you can find tons of young girls or college women close to you, yes? Is it about connection or ‘rescuing’, like a cult leader? I rest my case.

    Once again, am saying this considering you are real….which, I doubt you are.

  358. SunShineSD says:

    Thanks for the compliment on the first few posts on the subject. It’s not a joke. Just like your battle against posts promoting GPS months/weeks ago, these are public service posts to remind some readers that in addition to the single-point and double-point games bandied about, they still have the opportunity to make home-runs and touch-downs during their 15 years in the sun; don’t waste the game on some losers then become bitter in middle age and later.

  359. Kms2014 says:

    Hey, well I guess I am middle aged, then, hehe. And, that is okay with me. I happen to think Madeleine Stowe looks abosulutely amazing, and puts a lot of 20 something’s to shame, and she is 55 (: Age is not a big deal to me because some still ask if I am in my early twenties to late twenties, and I do not feel middle aged? Does that count for something? 😉 also, that just shows that you are ageist, when it comes to women, SunshineSD…it is fine to have a preference for younger women, many men do. But, the hateful way you spoke of my age and being bitter? Does not reflect well on you…of course, then again, you very well may be that teen or young man, in your 20’s pretending to be a SD.

    Also, down syndrome risk is not significant, at 35 or close to it….it is increased but not significant. Besides, even if you did have a child with Down syndrome or another genetic disorder/problem…which, there is a possiblity of this and other disorders, even in a woman’s 20’s, then what would you do? Would you abort the child or give it away? I am assuming this, yes, but you sure do seem to be obsessed with not having a child with Down syndrome, as if that would be the end of the world? Just curious…if you see these children as not worthy? Do you have the ‘final solution’ view, as Hitler did to these people and children,
    who were viewed as dregs on society? I have an in law, whose brother has a genetic disorder…and he was born, when the mother was 25. Also, my mother was in her very late 30’s, when she had me. And, I have no genetic disorder(that I know of, hehe!). I have several friends who have had children, in their late 30’s and early 40’s as well…with no problems.

    Don’t know why I am even responding….Am assuming all this, of course, since I don’t even think you are a real SD, anyways, but just completely and utterly mad….

  360. Josh says:


    “As for 20-something year old pretending to be 40~50, that’s your specialty, Josh.”

    For a man pretending to be so damn successful and high net worth through hard work, you should be able to use your own material and not constantly rely on the fiction wrought by the psychopath.

  361. SunShineSD says:

    37 is middle-aged for demographer interested having children not just having sex. 35 is the age above which Down’s syndrome risk becomes significant. 37 is beyond prime child bearing age. That’s why both the US Census and I draw the line at 35. As for Depends, that comes after 65 or 75.

    As for 20-something year old pretending to be 40~50, that’s your specialty, Josh.

  362. FatB'StardSA says:


    Your act was funny for a few posts. I doubt you came up with the idea because nothing you have posted recently is interesting at all. Ask to person who came up with the baby factory premise to write you some new material.

  363. SunShineSD says:

    US Census Bureau lists both 35-44 and 45-54 age groups as middle age.

  364. Kms2014 says:

    Thank you, Josh, That is kind of you to write…but now, I’m going to store to stock up on depends. They are having a good sale this week 😉 hehehe!

  365. Josh says:


    You surely don’t need me to say this but you’re fucking gorgeous at whatever age you currently happen to be. 😉

  366. Josh says:


    “Is 37 middle aged? Did not know this…”

    When I was 23 and dated a gorgeous 27 year-old I used to wonder if I was dating an old woman.

    37 is “middle aged” for a teen or a 20 something xbox player who likes to moonlight as an SB savior a la rent-a-womb man, who has yet to rent one.

  367. SunShineSD says:


    Post-doc studies in Ass(umptions) Making seem to be the standard practice around here lately.

  368. Josh says:

    AssD = Doctor of Assumptions?

  369. SunShineSD says:


    Testing, and dental dam if you are really afraid of STD. More importantly, one girl at a time instead of multiple concurrent partners, and stop choosing the ones that are so desperate that they have to have multiple clients at the same time as well. Her body fluid is going to be in the kiss, in the bed, in the hot tub, in the pool, etc..

  370. Josh says:


    “Josh~ Sometimes you make me laugh other times I’m in disbelief …”

    If you tell me what makes you laugh then I will up that line of postings. I want you to be happy when you read my posts…Deal? 😉

  371. SunShineSD says:


    LOL. One child per woman spread across a metropolitan area in different houses does not a baby factory make. There is however likely to be a support network for member families in the association, for things like baby sitting, after-school activities, landscaping, etc..

  372. SunShineSD says:


    There is not going to be any baby harvesting. There will be multiple independent families.

    Thanks for the religious cult suggestion, but I’m afraid you missed the memo about wanting the children to follow their mothers’ religions and culture. Your straw man must be tired of being beat up by you everyday. He might consider divorce you and seek child support from you.

  373. Josh says:


    You claim to be an intelligent fella, able to cut-n-paste all kinds of useless statistics.

    May I ask what part of “no fluid exchange” to limit STD exposure do you not understand?

  374. Kms2014 says:

    Why don’t we all just drop the baby talk, and start anew….anyone in favour of a new positive subject…? (:

  375. SunShineSD says:

    “Would you be able to share your own observations instead of inanely repeating the fiction created by the psychopath who used to frequent here?”

    Are you saying a previous instance of yourself claiming not wanting to orally please your SB was a psychopath? Perhaps Multiple-Personality-Disorder?

  376. Beach_Girl says:

    Hello Sugars!

    42SWM~ I don’t get why he wants to make a bunch a babies either…

    SunShine~ I don’t think KMS is trying to make SBs into failures, but you are trying to make them baby factories…

    Josh~ Sometimes you make me laugh other times I’m in disbelief …

  377. SunShineSD says:


    What baby harvest plan are you talking about? How do you harvest a baby anyway? Stop projecting your baby farm fantasy/dystopia. There is no harvest. I want each child to grow up an independent-minded young man or young woman, and for that I’m willing to forgo the economy of scale that comes with group housing.

    I tried charities and direct support to children in low-income families. Did not work. Lacking paternity meant not being able to keep a close eye on the individual children that it takes; a lot of questions simply could not be asked without intruding on people’s privacy. When they are in the wrong neighborhood with the wrong set of friends and surroundings, once a week meeting can not counterbalance the lure of drugs, etc..

    If it is sex that I’m after, the same amount of money, 10x national average for child support over multiple accounts, can buy far more sex than I can handle. Then there are the turkey baster accounts, I must love turkey baster and his sexual well being a lot. LOL. FYI, when it comes to sex, I’m more partial to quality than frequency . . . and I’m not into maintaining multiple sexual relationships at the same time.

  378. Josh says:

    The problem with the on-going mindfuck is that the two experiences he has shared are no shining examples of rent-a-womb project.

  379. Kms2014 says:

    Or, maybe, if you are being serious about baby harvesting, but you still are completely mad…. you should start your own cult? The most important character trait for any good cult leader is to be completely insane, yes? Aren’t cult leaders notorious for ‘helping’ and ‘rescuing’ very very young women, from the evils of society, which also happens to ‘always’ include lots of sex with these young but lost women, because the cult leader’s genes are superior, so that even the husbands of some of the female followers can never complain, due to their leader’s superior genetic potential? Just a thought….

  380. Josh says:



    Are you talking about yourself again? You are the one who consider SB’s below you, as you wouldn’t even consider eating her out when with your “SB”/escort. Stop projecting.”

    Would you be able to share your own observations instead of inanely repeating the fiction created by the psychopath who used to frequent here?

  381. Kms2014 says:

    Oh gosh, are you real, or just a teen/20 something who is playing on the internet? Seriously….

  382. SunShineSD says:


    Thank you for your very astute observation. I enjoy the company of highly intelligent and independent-minded/strong-willed women. However, one can see that the “entanglement” and negotiations becoming difficult when she reaches KMS’ age, when all her wits have no better place to use than ankle-biting . . . and divorce becoming much more expensive when she has no bright career future of her own to look forward to. My ex-wife was already joking about herself should have waited for 5yrs before filing for divorce. LOL.

  383. Kms2014 says:

    And do, pray tell…how am I trying to turn young SB’s into failures? Am just curious? Please, if anyone agrees or thinks SunshineSD baby harvest plan is a good idea, or thinks it is for the better of mankind, then I will reconsider. But, to me, I think you are the only are the only one who sees this as a great contribution to mankind.

    To be honest, if you really want to help those poor unfortunate women, then do charity work, or be a mentor, or big brother to the many children who are already without fathers or a strong role model…let them see you are not just trying to get into their panties. I notice, that your supposed ‘greater good’ includes having lots and incubation type sex sessions with very young women.

  384. Kms2014 says:

    Is 37 middle aged? Did not know this….

  385. SunShineSD says:


    Repeating known lies does not make them truthful. Your agenda at turning younger SB’s into failures and into bitter combative middle aged women like yourself is becoming quite obvious 😉 still doesn’t make you any more attractive 😉

  386. SunShineSD says:


    Are you talking about yourself again? You are the one who consider SB’s below you, as you wouldn’t even consider eating her out when with your “SB”/escort. Stop projecting.

  387. Kms2014 says:

    “42SWM says:
    June 5, 2014 at 6:48 am
    There is a difference between acknowledging that a problem exists and affirmatively taking action to bring about that same problematic outcome.

    You assume that any woman you would select to become a mother of your child would inevitably 100% otherwise become an unwed mother. If you goal is to mitigate against the social pathology of unwed mothers desperate for cash, starting off with the principle of first do no harm is the way to go. At a minimum, you should limit your prospects to ladies who are already single mothers and desperate for cash. That way, you are not inducing behavior that you are purportedly attempting to remedy.

    Otherwise, besides being creepy, the project of fathering lots of children that you will “harvest” (that was your word right?) in later years seems to be at least as grounded in feeding your own desires as it is in avoiding the outcome of children being raised in unnecessarily impoverished conditions.”

    Exactly! Thank you, 42SWM….I like this guy (: Welcome to the blog!

  388. SunShineSD says:


    Thank you for sharing your experience. You are exceptional in that you were able to extricate yourself from that situation and turn a new page in your life. For most women, being caught up in that situation would have started a downward spiral instead.

    I agree with you that I was unintentionally becoming an enabler. It’s hard for me to walk away from someone in real hardship, especially one previously intimate with, but walk away I must in this case. She is so head-strong that she thinks she can be the sole bread winner of her “family,” and let the baby daddy stay home and care for the baby, all on her associate degree; albeit I did help her pick a field that pays the most for an associate degree and helped her getting in and going through that program. She’d have near-zero chance of making it had she been in this situation when I met her 2.5 years ago, but now I’d estimate she has a 10-20% or so chance of making it work without having to resort to illegal entrepreneurship and risking losing custody of the child. I always liked her strong will, work ethics and entrepreneurial spirit, albeit almost always in the wrong fields! LOL. Probably because nobody had ever showed her how to apply the same skills to legit opportunities, nor the capital to get things started. If she had quit smoking when we were dating I would have got her pregnant, and she would have carried the baby to term. She is more in love with the baby than with the baby daddy. Given that baby is someone else’ child, my influence is limited. At the encouragement of her bf, her taking up smoking again after the mandatory quitting during the 3-month-long hospital stay was most disappointing, and put an end to any residual thought of helping her beyond basic humanitarian aid. Smoking is not just bad for health for her and the child, but also significantly negative for productivity, when one has to take time out repeatedly throughout the day.

  389. Josh says:

    The beauty of a mindfuck is that it requires no rhyme or reason. It just is. 😉

    Our rent-a-womb man considers SBs and SDs below him because he is allegedly rich a la high net worth, lasts for hours and is out to save SBs from johnish SDs.

  390. SouthernSB says:

    If 60% of the SD population are married then the SB’s are mistresses, and not necessarily prostitutes.

  391. SunShineSD says:


    No. Marriage and dating are not mutually exclusive. I did not date outside marriage when I was married, but some others do. The defining line between dating vs. p*/John is whether there is clear quid-pro-quo and whether the relationship is exclusively or almost exclusively about the sex-money exchange. If the girl only shows up at your place when her bills are due then hardly any contact for the rest of the month, that’s cutting close if not over the line regardless whether you are married. If it about one-time paid one-night-stand, then it’s even more obvious.

  392. Zack says:

    SunS: So if a qualified SB does accept your long term arrangement and bear a child, but then uses the additional income to decline into “bad habits” or if, over time, she demonstrates personality or parenting character that makes you worried for the development or environment of your mutual child…you have two solutions. First, master’s-level childcare. Second, a legal custody fight.

    Even though you have a backup plan for custody through your -ex, that second step is pretty big and an implicit threat. I think some of the outrage KMS and some others feel is from your having that option as a simple choice for you; you’re not “entangled” in the relationship in a way that would make it a difficult long-term negotiation with the child’s mother.

    Maybe, as suggested, single mothers would be a serious plus in your filters… that you may judge the all-important parenting environment and influence.

  393. Josh says:


    “Brandon married his former SB. He was obviously treating the site as a dating site, like I was.”

    60+% of the SD population at SA is married. They are definitely johns and the SBs who are hanging out with them are prostitutes then?

  394. SunShineSD says:

    Because it’s a type of arrangement, and it solves the complaint that GTT’s date was complaining: income from SD being unreliable. I’d think her complaint was not alone.

  395. 42SWM says:

    Not sure what the fascination with impregnating a bunch of women is about in the SA context of all places. LOL.

  396. SunShineSD says:

    That’s why common law husbands and wives were so common back then.

  397. SunShineSD says:


    Brandon married his former SB. He was obviously treating the site as a dating site, like I was.

    OTOH, from my experience using the site as SD interacting with SB’s, there are some escorts using the site to recruit clients, so it should not be a surprise that some men would use the site like a John would.

  398. Josh says:

    “Marriage was an arrangement for (the upper class) raising children to begin with, popularized to the working class only after industrialization,”

    Hmmm, so before 1750s in yhe western world and much later in the rest of the world, working class people were just having sex outside of marriage…so continues the mindfuck…

  399. SunShineSD says:


    I’m not into Eugenics at all. The primary purpose of paternity is ensuring paternal right to intervene if the mother proves incapable handling the resources properly, instead of having to cut both off and inevitably harming the child as otherwise would be the case. That, and ensure that I would be invested for the entire duration. That’s why my baseline requirement are fairly loose, and no race or religious components. In fact, I want the children to follow the mothers’s religions (or lack thereof) and culture.

  400. Josh says:


    So you believe that answering my question requires dating an SD? Hmmmm…. LOL!

    Also, thanks for confirming that for YOU the arrangements that don’t look like your type of arrangements are prostitution sponsored by Johns.

    Now I am expecting the famous last words, such as, “I was misunderstood”, “you are twisting my words”, “you are quoting me out of context”, etc.

    How about Brandon Wade, is he a Super John? 😉

  401. SouthernSB says:

    It just sounds like you are practicing some sort of twisted kind of eugenics, and you are trying to breed the perfect children. I’m not a fan of eugenics, being of woman of color and all, but you need to know that no matter how much you try to make the perfect society things don’t always turn out as planned.

  402. SunShineSD says:


    No, “Harvest” was not my word, just like “baby farm” was a pejorative used by someone else.

    The social pathology is not single-parenthood, but children born into and raised in poverty. When household incomes/net-worths are accounted for, single parent family is not disadvantaged per se. Among upper income and upper middle class families, single parents are doing very well, no worse than their stay-married peers if household incomes are comparable. Marriage is a safety net in case one parent can not provide for the child, not a magic carpet. That safety net can be provided by a system that does not cap the woman’s potential like the typical government safety nets do.

    I’m trying to replace the reality of women in lower income facing raising children 80% as single parent in poverty plus another 19+% in poverty anyway regardless staying married or divorce later, with 100% middle class to upper middle class household environment for the child and the option for the woman to marry someone else later in better socioeconomic surroundings, if marriage is her thing.

    Marriage was an arrangement for (the upper class) raising children to begin with, popularized to the working class only after industrialization, nowadays with average duration much shorter than the 20 or so years that takes a child to grow up anyway. Not sure what the fascination with marriage is about in the SA context, of all places. LOL.

  403. KatPaw says:


    Ohh you are not the only SD out there that wants to produce children with his SBs.. I remember a profile I saw several months ago of a man who specifically had in his profile about having children.

  404. KatPaw says:

    Ohhh and I also agree looking at woman who are already single mothers may be best too.

  405. KatPaw says:


    I think that experience with your last SB had jaded you a bit.. And think it stupid you still supported her after such a breech of trust! Truthfully your support is probably why she keeps loser bf around.. Because she thinks she “loves” him.
    I had my oldest daughter young when I was 19.. Well I learned fast no matter how much I thought I ” loved” my xbox playing looser bf he was never going to become a real father or partner! He was so selfish he only saw himself. I’ll never regret having my daughter she made me grow up and be a woman and not a stupid girl. The experience was a major lesson but in the end it help me know what to have in a good life partner.

  406. SunShineSD says:

    I never dated another SD, so I don’t know what the statistical distribution is like for the entire pool of SD’s. I treated my SB’s like girlfriends that I would help out anyway both regularly and when needed. I even helped out my last SB for over a year after she got pregnant with someone else and we stopped dating each other. I don’t see anything “John” in that.

  407. KatPaw says:

    @ 42SWM

    Welcome to the blog! Always nice to have new participants.

  408. SunShineSD says:


    I tend to take each individual case by case. The baseline requirements are:

    1. Intelligence and patience;

    2. Good work ethics when the rewards are present; i.e. goal-seeking personality;

    (Many SA girls tend to have above two points down pat, in my experience)

    3. Free of (significant) genetic disease, and other diseases that can be easily passed to the child and/or me; the physical fitness for bearing child.

    4. Free of significant bad habits. This is not a requirement at the start of dating, but when it is time to get pregnant the person need to demonstrate the ability to abstain from smoking and alcohol for 9 months. I don’t want the stress of quitting and pregnancy take place at the same time. I used to include minor recreational drugs also in that category of allowed during dating, but the last experience convinced me to tighten up a bit, not so much due to the substance itself but the company such activities bring due to illegality, especially because I don’t use any myself so the person has to enjoy that aspect of her life with someone else, the quality of which is problematic under the existing legal environment.

    5. Financial responsibility to be learned during dating. Most girls run into financial difficulties because of lack of proper financial education, which is entirely missing in today’s typical educational experience. I’m confident of being able to teach that during dating before I get the girl pregnant. If no dating is involved and the baby is to be made via turkey baster, then the woman has to come with proof of her own solid resource management skills.

  409. Josh says:


    “Josh~ rent a womb, you aren’t better…”

    Say what? 😉

  410. 42SWM says:

    There is a difference between acknowledging that a problem exists and affirmatively taking action to bring about that same problematic outcome.

    You assume that any woman you would select to become a mother of your child would inevitably 100% otherwise become an unwed mother. If you goal is to mitigate against the social pathology of unwed mothers desperate for cash, starting off with the principle of first do no harm is the way to go. At a minimum, you should limit your prospects to ladies who are already single mothers and desperate for cash. That way, you are not inducing behavior that you are purportedly attempting to remedy.

    Otherwise, besides being creepy, the project of fathering lots of children that you will “harvest” (that was your word right?) in later years seems to be at least as grounded in feeding your own desires as it is in avoiding the outcome of children being raised in unnecessarily impoverished conditions.

    @all: Thanks for the welcome.

  411. Josh says:


    Are most SDs on SA monthly/weekly/p4p JOHNs in your opinion?

  412. SunShineSD says:

    Some may consider hiring surrogate mother for a one time fee of $25k-35k “Rent-a-Womb.” How is providing substantial support and follow-up to the mother and child for decades “Rent-a-Womb”? Following that kind of twisted counter-factual logic, do you consider decades long marriage “One-night-stand”? or your own activities every month with less than eager girls desperate to pay bills “rape”?

  413. KatPaw says:

    @ Sunshine

    Ok all this negative bs aside.. I do have a question that’s been on my mind.. Something you said about the the maternal side.. What qualifies a woman to be a mother of your child? I really am curious what type of requirements you have..

  414. flyR says:

    How often do you login? Most search recently logged in.. ”

    Default is most recent profile so making a small change to the profile will move it to the front of the results 0

  415. SunShineSD says:


    “Weak minded” was an assessment / accusation from someone else. I was making the point that today’s young women, especially those self-selecting to be on SA, are not weak-minded at all. My experience is that many tend to be very strong-willed, in fact, too strong, IMHO. I was saying that, the take-no-prisoners approach some of them have in life may not be helpful to themselves in the long run.

    I agree, some degree of mutual respectfulness should be maintained in a conversation, even for people with divergent views. Snide remarks and straw man tactics are not helpful.

  416. SunShineSD says:

    Your “Rent-a-womb mindfuck” accusation was obviously addressed to me not any women who might be interested in collaborating with me. So my question was what’s so superior about your monthly Rent-A-Pussy approach? Women can choose whatever she wishes with her own body (just don’t expect cooperation from me in certain combinations of endeavors), I do not however think highly of your bottom-feeding John approach to exploiting vulnerable women.

  417. KatPaw says:

    Morning sugars!

  418. aliceS says:

    Sataney shibari lol 😉 that last part is hilarious 😉

  419. Beach_Girl says:

    Hello Sugars

    What a crazy day for me 🙂

    I see the rudeness is back… why can’t we all be respectful?

    Sunshine~ Weak minded and rent a pussy, seriously?

    Josh~ rent a womb, you aren’t better…

    sorry, but your behaviors are crazy. Why be like that? I know we are all different, but we should all respect each other, if you can’t do so, leave or refrain from posting such comments…

    42SWM~ Welcome to the blog 😀

  420. Josh says:

    If a man genuinely believes that it is a woman’s choice to rent her pussy, then why try to put her down for doing so?

  421. SunShineSD says:

    As opposed to Rent-a-pussy??? 😉

  422. Josh says:

    Rent-a-womb mindfuck continues unabated. 😉

  423. SunShineSD says:

    “Weak-mindedness” is the least of worries among today’s young, especially the SA self-selected population. If anything, it is the overwhelming urge to be above others that’s the problem. Pop culture seems to have promoted self-confidence to such a degree that vanity and pride have taken over. The need to win every argument everyday means driving out competent peers and advisers, replacing them with incompetents and sycophants, who are utterly useless during moments of crisis and opportunity. We all have personal crises at some points in our lives.

  424. SunShineSD says:


    Good point on chicken vs. egg, whether middle-class value comes first or middle-class resources come first. I think both aspects feed back on each other. Government aid programs suffer from two problems due to political necessity:

    1. The recipient can not accumulate capital while on the program, so she can never achieve middle class independence;

    2. The cash portion is small; much of the subsidies are really subsidies to various service providers. Not advocating raising cash portion anyway, because there is little supervision and the effective ban on capital accumulation means raising cash subsidy would just raise waste and breed bad habits.

    The development of Middle-class value, sense of independence and responsible behavior, needs a material base to make responsible behavior rewarding.

    Why not spend the money on existing children in poverty? Without paternity, it would be unwarranted intrusion to keep track of how the resources are utilized and interact with the child on a regular basis. Without paternity, the mother receiving the substantial resources would be a magnet for losers without the risk of losing physical custody of the child.

  425. SunShineSD says:

    @42SWM @KMS

    Welcome to the blog 42, and thank you for your candidness in your first posts. First posts took a while to be approved.

    KMS, 42 proved my earlier point that background noises do matter. Platitudes and lies repeated enough times become believable. Your exaggerations and false representations of my project seems to have worked on someone as intended. LOL. Someone actually believes there is a baby farm. Funnier still was someone extolling on SA the virtues of marriage supposedly because marriage somehow avoid the distraction of dating. Putting aside the common sense that the woman wouldn’t put up with the man for long if he stops dating her after marriage, I’d think there are only 3 types of people on SA: married and still dating outside the marriage; divorced because he/she tried marriage but like single life better; someone never married and regurgitating whatever is heard in mainstream brainwashing regarding marriage.

    As far as kids are concerned, the marriage advantage is merely a reflection of household income advantage and economy of scale in running a household. It’s pronounced among low income and lower-middle income families because living under one roof has significant economy of scale. The advantage disappears entirely for parents who can comfortably afford maintaining two separate households, with full-time live-in nannies when necessary. Kids raised in single-parent families are not disadvantaged at all if the single parent has more income than the two-parent family, especially if there is also room in the budget for maintaining a full time childcare provider

    It’s silly to decry baby farm and “separating half-siblings” at the same time. One or the other; they are mutually exclusive. Besides, are you really against children born to second marriages? especially among second marriages after amicable divorces, where kids would socialize like cousins.

    It’s not replacing X-anyway with the same X. The X is children raised in poverty and/or welfare dependency, which would not be the case at all in the plan. The flood is coming, whether you like it or not. Instead of single-mindedly raising levee, the more effective solution is channeling the water in a safe course. Promoting marriage to a target audience where 80+% do not get married before having children is about as silly as promoting abstinence to college students where 80+% are not virgins. Making condoms available for free seems to be a far better solution even if it is not someone’s “ideal.”

    Even that “ideal” is severely degenerated in today’s individualistic society. Children born into wedlock do not typically have intact family throughout their childhood. Divorce rate is over 50%, and many of the other half are barely together “for the children” because they can not afford maintaining two separate households; many live in poverty or barely getting by anyway even while married. Average child support is less than $400/mo, and median child support is less than $300/mo. That is the reality of what young mothers face. Not “some young mothers,” not “many young mothers,” but All young mothers with children face as the statistic average and mean! For every single one getting more than the statistical mean, there is another below that number! What is your brilliant idea to provide a better reality for young mothers?

  426. SunShineSD says:

    From an SD’s perspective, giving out the address and inviting a complete stranger to one’s own home without even meeting in a public place first is a rather risky proposition. Unless the SD lives in a place with armed guard, the SD is probably not worthy of a burglar’s visit, much less by an SB or GF. LOL.

  427. aliceS says:

    At least I am still sa virgin 🙂 and wasn’t screwed by some crazy freak 😉

  428. Josh says:

    JamieSB is correct. There seems to be something wrong where Alice is.

  429. JamieSB says:

    @ KatPaw:
    Yes we are going away for a trip next week. He is looking for a holiday house either in beach or mountain so we might go for a little road trip. Though he is more seeking for GF not just SB but he is known to be very generous. Bought his last GF an expensive car.
    @ Flyer
    Aw thank you for your concern. He is retired from playing so I don’t think I need to worry about his mate. He is a real gent thou and from a very solid background family.
    @ AliceS
    Oh that’s horrible you suspend your account. Maybe you should move to Australia! So many real gents here for special and nice girls like yourself!!!

  430. KatPaw says:

    How often do you login? Most search recently logged in.. Really when on line you want to re login at least every half hour. This get your profile seen by SDs.

  431. aliceS says:

    Katpaw I hope it’s a hot one 19y.o lol

  432. KatPaw says:

    Wow just saw youngest SD profile I’ve ever seen before.. 19! Dang lol wonder if daddy told him about site?!

  433. aliceS says:

    Hey Kitty 😉 no. But it’s useless for 9 month already. What is the point of keeping the account? I’m just overwhelmed by lack of any kind of contact or disappearing by sd after 2 mails

  434. KatPaw says:


    I’m sorry to hear this.. Anything in particular that caused this?

  435. aliceS says:

    I’m so bored. And I suspended my account. It just madness with all of the bs about sd and sb. I’m tired. And I’m done.
    Richard awwwww thank you 😉 glad you like it 🙂

  436. KatPaw says:

    I have cut my photos back to 4 public

  437. KatPaw says:


    I know some older generations ( still think tatts are taboo or trashy.. Not all since my last SD was 62. It’s why I’m open about them it’s not like I have a tiny little tatt.. My back is a canvas of art.. So figure easier to eliminate those who find it a turn off right off the bat. Ahh this most recent poof has me still a bit confused myself.. Who knows what’s up with that. I even got a second opinion on all our convos and it left them baffled at the poof as well.

  438. Josh says:


    I think you can drop some of the pictures that are a bit blurry and replace them with sharper ones.

    One aspect of the pictures you might want to weigh in is that in your effort to be open and honest about your tattoos, some SDs “may” be getting a wrong message.

    Your tattoos are almost as gorgeous as you are. But please keep in mind that tattoos didn’t become commonplace until very recently. So some of these SDs in their 40s or 50s missed the memo by a long shot.

    So it is a six of one or half dozen of the other. As a proud tattooed young woman, you either filter out tattoo-averse now or filter them out later.

    That said, I am not sure why the one’s you have gone some distance with have been flaking out. I will need more data to comment on.

    Your profile seems fine as well. I may be able nitpick some but not much.

  439. flyR says:

    @jamie SB

    Hopefully it is something that will convert to real sugar although pro athletes are often have groupies in tow.

    It’s also ok if some force took you into the doughnut shop on the way to your diet coach. You’ll never know the limits of the straight and narrow unless you hop off once in a while.

  440. KatPaw says:


    Well that sounds like an amazing first meet.. Talk of next meet arrangement?

  441. Josh says:

    Happy humping? 😉

  442. SouthernSB says:


  443. SouthernSB says:

    Good morning sugars!! Hope everyone is having a fun and Profitible day.
    @Richard-That’s the great thing about NY, everybody can have fun and even move up on little money, one good dress (or suit), hard work and self-confidence as long as they use their wits and their brain. They keep saying that there is no way to move up in NYC, but I mostly think that the problem the is a sense of entitlement, lack of confidence, inability to use the education that you were given (in the case of the kids who grew in the projects), bad parenting, and just plain fear of change (by everyone involved). I’ve seen it happen with girls I’ve known and in my own family. You can’t get ahead if you don’t get on stage and try. Like my mother always told me, “The worst they can do is say, ‘No.'”

  444. Richard says:

    @AliceS – Nice nails, very hot. You can scratch those down my back…but gently, please! 🙂

  445. Richard says:

    @SouthernSB – I too lived in NYC back when I had little money and managed to enjoy it on a very tight budget. Then I met an older woman and moved in with her. I guess I was a sugar baby for a while. Except she was HOT and I would have dated her even if she didn’t have money. 😉

    So I guess now I’m just paying it forward.

    There really are many New Yorks. The one the multimillionaire hedge fund manager experiences is very different from the hourly worker commuting from the Bronx. I like pieces of both.

    @JamieSB – I’m flattered. And I love Australian accents. Especially if you look like Elle MacPherson (long time crush, used to run across her occasionally back in the day, never got very far, but not from lack of trying!).

  446. JamieSB says:

    I organised 3 coffee dates today. Got stuck at first date: 2 coffee shops, one restaurants, 3 bars, 11.5 hours later.. I cancelled my other dates, he missed all his work today including a media interview ( he is an ex pro football player)!
    Longest first ‘coffee’ date of my life!!
    I guess I don’t make a good SB more a sugary gf!
    Hope everyone has great sugaring time : )

  447. KatPaw says:

    Happy HUMP day sugarrrrs!

  448. Sataney Shibari says:

    Ah, isn’t it ironic that the only arrangement I’ve ever had was before I learned about this site? Many may complain about the sex part on this site but believe me, it’s even more frustrating when a man adores you to pieces, puts up with your diva behaviour and even embraces it, to the point even his wife fawns over you….yet he’s got a face and body only a mother could love and you would rather die under a bridge than kiss him. Tragedy.

  449. flyR says:


    Lots of sound advice from KMS. Asking you to take a cab to meet at a hotel room or private residence on fist meet is not the norm. Yes it does happen with good results but it is generally a bad idea and ALWAYS a bad idea for a newbie unless you are packing some heat or have blackbelt level martial arts skills.

    A serious SD will let you pick the place for the first meeting. As a general rule it should be public and casual.

    One of the most common traits of a social predator(bad guy) is constant efforts to separate intended victims from those around them (both fiends and strangers).

    Consider the cost of the cab ride to have been an inexpensive education. But don’t get depressed.

    Sit down with a glass of wine and retrace the adventure from first contact to unwanted advances. Were there signals , danger signs what have you learned? Was there someone else whom you ignored because this dirtbag seemed perfect?

    Look for danger signs
    – Not concerned about excessive allowance ( never intends to pay)

    – Wants to get you alone too early

    – Unwilling to give verifiable personal information

    – Pressures you (wants x rated photos, x rated skype etc)

    – Overly attracted to your newness

    If you want to take it slow then say so in your profile but in a positive way. ie I am looking for a man with the patience and interest to get to know me Think of it as an investment of your time that’s likely to return a fantasy fulfilled if you are the right one.

  450. Kms2014 says:

    Hey, Texas, no worries…don’t know if it is wisdom or more of ‘trial and error’, over time…and also got some good tips, on blog, before from some of other people. I think some SB just go into this thinking that the men will find them(I used to think this), and some do, but sometimes the ones you want…the SDs who do not have as much time to search, due to their busy careers…well, you might have to find them. This, helps you figure out what you want, too. Have learned a lot more, even in the last few months, from some helpful people on here (:

    If you want, can email me terrahleigh2014 at gmail dot com

    I am not a profile expert, but might be able to help a little, if you would like to email your profile….

  451. KatPaw says:

    Ok got a couple ladies opinions how about you men out there?

  452. KatPaw says:


    I wouldn’t of asked if I couldnt take it! Thank you.. I agree with removing a couple of pics but I will keep the bikini since it is a good “full body” pic. I am personally not into selfies.. Plus having to replace my phone recently i lost alot of pictues! :*-( miss pictures i had on there especially of kiddos..
    And yeah yeah yeah Im old but dont look it! Lol
    The married thing is a toss up some like that fact because they know i wont be trying to throw any shackles on..
    Ahhh my tatts I love the artwork that is on my skin canvas.. But i know to some it is a turn off and others a turn on.. One reason Im open about it and have the pics to show it.

  453. Texas says:

    Thanks Kms2014. I need help with my profile, but I dont want to put my pro number on here :/ I appreciate your advice and wisdom very much.

  454. JamieSB says:

    *which I can

  455. JamieSB says:

    Kudos on you for not doing things you are not comfortable with : )
    Thank you for sharing your profile. Apologise in advance in I sound harsh with I can be at times.

    Your profile is perfect with the writings I wouldn’t change a thing. However, I personally would work on the pictures. In SA, pictures mean more than a thousand words right?

    The first picture is perfect as it shows your beautiful face, so I will definitely keep that. I would suggest thou to remove the pictures in bikini, in red dress and even the last one as they don’t do you justice, honestly it does scream tackiness. Those pictures surely don’t scream sophistication and therefore probably won’t attract the genuine, educated and wealthier SDs.

    I guess it depends what type of SDs you are after. And you might find your perfect SD with your current profile. But to attract the one mentioned above, it takes more work. Your weaknesses ( which could become your strengths) are:
    1/ You are married
    2/ You have tattoos ( lots of it)
    3/ You are a mature-ish SB.

    So bear that in mind. Sometimes it is not your profile per se, it is your circumstances making it more harder to find a SD.

    Sorry not sure if it helps Kat. If you want to have a look at my profile, I am happy to email it to you. But either way, fingers crossed : )


  456. Kms2014 says:

    @Texas…hey, no…do not feel bad. I am an older SB, who has lived a little, and watched too much crime tv, in the past during those nights with insomnia :-/ Anyways, if I had been in this lifestyle, in my early/mid 20’s then I might have done some really irresponsible things–was very sheltered, even in my late 20’s, a bit. Anyway, not saying it is due to your age, but many times young girls, on SA, just have never seen or had the misfortune of encountering such predators(luckily) that they have the opportunity to encounter here. Sugaryspicey, actually mentioned there are websites where fake SD’s post SB profiles, pictures and porn videos of the SB they scam into sex, or worse. Just, be very cautious. It takes practice, and never let desperation take a front seat to safety. Worse case scenario, a homeless shelter for a few weeks would be much preferred to rape or other horrible alternatives…

    Don’t feel bad, though. When I was new, I got scammed too, but more with my ‘time’ and it being wasted. Wish I had read blog back then, so is good you are reading now. Some girls and guys, here on blog, have great tips, on safety, and what to look for, in regards to determine a fake, from a real SD. Although, even a seasoned SB can still be tricked once in awhile. Some fake SD are that good! And, if you stick around on blog, you will definitely hear the stories from men being scammed, by SB. Although, at least none of them have the potential to be raped, physically– they can be mentally and financially, though.

    Anyway, my advice on finding real versus fake is how they write in their profile. Can usually tell if the man is truly successful, intelligent, kind…thoughtful and a gentleman through this. However, this can also be copied from another man’s profile, but you can probably figure this out pretty quickly with email communication. That would be another weeding process…how they email, and if they ‘ask’ for your name, phone number…ect., in a kind and thoughtful manner. Never demand…and, I stay away from the ones who email ‘text me’ before they even ask for my name. Also, a good phone conversation or skype chat for a little bit might be good, in order to verify if the man is who he says he is(in looks). If he gives his real name, position…is good to try and do a good background check on him, through google, tineye his pics…just to check to see if he is who he says he is. Once, you meet him for potential meet for coffee, drink or dinner, then you can decide if you want to pursue further(I prefer coffee, so I can bail if things go pear-shaped, or him as well)…it can be a bit of a process, and takes time….Even more than regular dating, but sometimes much more fun. And the benefits, when you do find a good one, will help outweigh all the bad, experienced, in the past. (:

  457. Texas says:


  458. Texas says:

    I should have mentiones that he attempted to beg me to stay the night…seriously!!! I nearly cried on the way home in the cab, because I dont know how much longer I can go at this.

  459. Eloquence says:

    To all the ladies, always remember you ARE THIS: Youtube: Eric Paslay – “Song About A Girl”

  460. Texas says:

    @Kms2014: Thanks, I agree with not meeting anyone at their place. I dont know what I was thinking, like everyone else here Im getting pretty desperate so I figured it was worth a try. I am new here, Ive been on SA for months and that was my very first meeting. Needless to say Im worried about any other pot SD’s here now too. How is one to know the fakes from the really good SD’s?
    @Alice: Yes, high 5 I really know how to pick em huh? lol

  461. Kms2014 says:

    Pretty good article*

  462. Kms2014 says:

    Also, a real SD would never ask or make you pay the cab fare to go to him, whether meeting him at a restaurant or wherever…very bad sign. You must be new, but there is a big weeding out process to undertake, on SA, am afraid. Many fakes….both men and women, unfortunately. It takes time but if any red flags are perceived in initial communications, then don’t even bother meeting them.

    Think SA did a good blog on signs of fakes and flakes awhile back as well? And one of main things mentioned was not meeting SD for first time, at their home? Cannot remember….but, was pretty article.

  463. Kms2014 says:

    I meant, once there was an SD that I met, for first meet, in a public place, but for the next meet, he started pressuring me to meet at his place. Any kind of pressure put on you, by an SD, is a sign of no gentleman or good SD. And, have never met a real Sd that wanted me to meet at his place/home for a first meet, so would have to say, as far as real SD, then, no, is not common.

  464. 42SWM says:

    Ladies, never have a first meeting anywhere but a public place. A good faith SD will understand you being strict about that rule. A bad faith SD will be weeded out. Even though I generally need a SB to come to me, I always pick a place by her for a first meeting. No exceptions.

  465. Kms2014 says:

    @Texas…is VERY dangerous to meet a POT, at his place, for the first meet. Especially, if he refused to meet in a public spot, and he lives near or in your town. He could have raped you(which, sounds like he tried) or much much worse….

    I don’t know if it is common or not, but even the SD whom I have met in person, at a public place before, and then he was pressuring me to meet at his place for second meet. I refused. A gentleman will NEVER pressure you into something/anything you don’t want to do. SS has some great safety tips, if you have ever seen her past posts?

  466. aliceS says:

    Texas been there as well. Met with one crazy dude, I payed the expenses as well, and he tried to have sex right away as well. So, sadly, high five on it

  467. Texas says:

    Im starting to lose faith in the whole SD thing. I think I need help with my profile because I have only met 1 pot SD and it was not that great. I met him in person(at his place) he refused to meet me in public, and attempted to force himself on me after 10 mins. Not to mention I had to pay for the cab to get to his place which cost me $45 total (including tip) So that was my first experience with the SD. Not good. Is it common to not want to meet in public? I was very uneasy meeting at his place for the first time, is it just me? I dont know…*sigh*

  468. KatPaw says:


    Yes my husband works full time plus any ot he can get. At one point I had 3 that were 2 and under. Trust me there were days I wished I was the one to go off to work.. Now they are a bit older… Still have over a year till the littles start kindergarten. Then it’s back to higher education for myself! Lol

  469. SunShineSD says:

    You have a working family. Your husband works, I presume, full time if not more. My preference is for the mother to stay home for at least a few months to a year after the child is born in the case of one baby; for multiple kids, having the mother staying home may well be a better solution than alternatives. Of course, it’s up to each mother’s own decision. My ex-wife mostly stayed home for two years after giving birth.

    That’s why I think my package is also appealing to women who already have a career but also want some time off to have a child and take care of the child herself instead of by baby sitters.

  470. KatPaw says:


    See some would argue that I should work.. The funny thing is with having younger children I’d be paying most my earning to someone else to “watch” them. Is rather have to struggle and be tightly budgeted home raising my kids with manners respect and values then have a bit extra cash flow and my kids not truly raised in the way I wish.

  471. SunShineSD says:

    Sorry about that. I did not mean to offend. I was referencing some single-parent family welfare abusers that make a habit of receiving aid while avoid working altogether, not a working class family struggling to get by like yours.

  472. SunShineSD says:

    *with the mother

  473. SunShineSD says:

    My previous post to Zack may have answered some of your questions. The amount of support I provide is a function of the number of child I have the mother. She will certainly have her right to date another man and have child(ren) with him if that is her desire. She will not need to date anyone for financial considerations. My hope is that my financial support on account of my child will provide the breathing room for her to build a productive career of her own on top of the support that she receives from me. What she wants to do with her own private parts after giving birth to my child and nursing the child is entirely her own beeswax. I’m not the least bit jealous when my ex-wife tells me about her dating exploits despite the 15x national average child support that I am paying her every month. My daughter seems to be very comfortable with the idea that her mom and I get along very well like siblings living separate private lives; she was just telling me about her looking forward to meeting the new guy mom is dating, and wondering when I would be getting back with my ex-GF. LOL.

  474. 42SWM says:

    Question: What comes first, the chicken or the egg?

    Is a middle class home economically prosperous because the values of the inhabitants enable prosperity? Or do middle class values result when there is a sufficient level of financial resources? I think the various social welfare programs in the US and the rest of the western world answer these questions quite clearly. Unless you are going to somehow ensure that your baby mamas don’t date the wrong men (and I don’t think there is a practical way of doing that), the babyfarm concept is just going to money-over various non-economic pathologies.

  475. KatPaw says:


    Sometimes those family that have “fallen on bad luck ” really have just that. Is it bad behavior that my family is a single income family because we thought it best and most logical that I stay home to raise our children? I think a major problem with the children of today’s society is that they aren’t being raised but watched by strangers.
    Well we make too much for any “assistance” but bills killing us since this move.. Plus looks like we will have to do a long distance move yet again for the hubby’s job.

  476. Kms2014 says:

    Katpaw, found a few grammatical errors, in your last two paragraphs. Not to be the grammar police…

  477. SunShineSD says:

    Thanks. The dating period would help weed out the unsuitable candidates. I would not get a woman pregnant before she is ready/qualified to be a mother of my child, and I have very good track record of controlling myself. The child bearing experience itself often makes the woman more mature and responsible, especially with proper follow-up and so long as she does not fall back into bad company tempting her. My having joint legal custody will give me the right to keep an eye on the child and how the household is run, encouraging the mother to use the resources from me to build and enhance her career at her own pace instead of wasting it on excessive parties. Worse comes to worst, the last resort would be taking physical custody of the child myself. Those legal rights that come with being the biological father make a huge difference compared to merely showering money on families “fallen on bad luck.” I do not wish to be an enabler of bad behavior.

  478. Kms2014 says:

    What is ‘AA’ escort, by the way? Are escorts ranked like bonds? AAA, Aa, Baa, BBB+, C, like prime, high grade, medium grade….junk? Wonder what I would be, if I were a bond….hmmm

    Curious again…

  479. Kms2014 says:

    If you will allow and support other men and the babies she might potentially have with them?

  480. Kms2014 says:

    I’m just asking these questions, by the way…please, don’t consider them attacks. I really am curious of you allow other males to move into your ‘paid for’ middle class home, and will you also support other babies, from other men…? Am curious…

  481. Kms2014 says:

    How about, if some of the weak minded women, who he does impregnate(considering, this is true) still have babies with deadbeat xbox players, under his ‘palace of intrigue’ middle class roof….will he then support said deadbeat Xbox player boyfriend and her other babies with the xbox player, that are not by him? Is sterilization after childbirth of sunshine Jr., part of the contract? Not making assumptions…just thinking out loud 😉

  482. SunShineSD says:

    “Crazy” perhaps in the sense that it is not profitable in the monetary sense. However, considering the decline of middle class in this country, especially whats facing young mothers and children as shown in the statistics above, this endeavor will result in better returns than spending money fighting random diseases on a different continent.

  483. Kms2014 says:

    Katpaw, am about to look at your profile…sorry, about the crazy conversations detracting from your questions (:

  484. 42SWM says:

    One thing that kids of single parents miss out on, is the example of an enduring marriage—warts and all. A lot of escorts, strippers, etc. come from homes where the mother is focused on dating. Parenting takes effort. To purposely create a situation where kids will be raised by a parent who will have energy diverted to dating is wrong. It is one thing to be supportive of single parents when that outcome is unintentional. However, to purposefully embrace that goal in multiple iterations is not helping society out, the moms, or the kids. If someone really wants to help out society, moms, kids, et al. help support the kids whom are ALREADY born. Otherwise, what I hear being described is merely an excuse for conduct that flatters the ego and creates more problems than it solves.

  485. Zack says:

    @KMS I think Suns is real and only partly crazy. I expect his baby support and consistency would appeal to some women…even some on a career track.

    I’d be more interested in how he weeds out the ones who would use him as a sinecure and not raise the children well. Contract marriage is a long way off. (Focus on the “contract” part.)

  486. Kms2014 says:

    Don’t really care if you make assumptions….that is your right. Also, I still think you are quite crazy, lol.

    Gtt, is just a joke. Lighten up, dear. I don’t judge people for using escorts, or looking on an escort site, sheesh, hehe. 😉

  487. 42SWM says:

    I have been a reader of this blog for a couple of weeks. For the most part, the people writing here seem fun and interesting. A couple of things are kind of disturbing. The “babyfarm” idea falls into that category. Purposely creating a large group of half-siblings who will by design not have the benefit of each other (not to mention a father) in their lives is a cruel thing to do. What happens to kids who grow up without fathers? What happens to kids raised by exhausted mothers? Many become scammers on SA or worse. The logic of “X is going to happen anyway, so I am going to purposely make X happen” can justify just about anything.

  488. SunShineSD says:

    You are making a lot of unwarranted assumptions, and flat out mis-characterizations. I have been incredibly patient with your put-downs up to this point. Please do not force me into making assumptions about your life. There is no “baby farm” per se, as I repeatedly corrected that wrong assumption. The assumption about absentee-dad is entirely unwarranted, and I corrected that several times already. There is an obvious reason why I want to limit geographical reach to one metropolitan area: so I can be available to the children.

    Let’s take a look at what passes for “normal” facing a young mother: more than half of all marriages end in divorce, less than 1/4 amicably; those of lower income have even higher failure rate. A typical child born out of wedlock has both parents under the same roof for no more than 2-3yrs, if at all to begin with; nearly half of all newborns are now born out of wedlock; the number is close to 80% for lower-income demographic. The average child support is less than $400/mo, and there are millions of accounts in delinquency.

    In contrast to all of that, I’m offering a child support 10x the national average, a house to live in, and a support network for baby sitting, early childhood development, after-school and vacation activities with highly qualified educational professionals in addition to parents. When my own child was little, it became clear to me that Master Degree holders in early childhood development really do know their chops and deliver a qualitative difference vs. mere baby sitters, relatives or even parents! But at $3000+/mo, very few families can afford that. My hopes of generating economy of scale within a family by having multiple kids was dashed when my ex-wife couldn’t have more children after the first. That’s why I’m quite motivated and dedicated to the project for providing a brighter future for the children and women than they otherwise would have. The living in separate house plan is not because I do not wish to spend more time with the children, but so that the women can date other people and the children can grow up with a sense of middle class independence, instead of catty “palace intrigues.”

  489. gtt_envy says:

    I personally think there are many escorts on sa.com especially AA ones.

    How is your SD KMS?

  490. gtt_envy says:

    Yes and No 🙂

    She had a profile on a escort sute and on sa.com. If you knew me you would know I hate transactional sex. I’m a white knight text, talk, share, it can’t be a act, but when she was running late I was determined to do something.

    May have been the “alcohol lol” and when I went to e.c.c.I.e under the city I was in she was there too.

    It is what it is. Nothing I would ever pursue but was fun.

    I enjoy exclusivity!! 🙂

  491. Kms2014 says:


  492. Kms2014 says:

    Gets date was an escort, by the way…that he just happened to run across, while bored, on escort site 😉 of course….hehe

  493. Kms2014 says:

    “The way to get consistent income from a man of substance is really quite simple, it’s not sex per se but . . . much to the consternation of the fakes and wannabes.”

    So, you imply one must have a baby with an SD, and raise without the father in the home helping in the everyday raising of the child, so that she can have a ‘reliable’ and ‘steady’ income stream? Erm, any woman with a good education and small helping of self respect and independence would not want to be part of a baby farm, with no man to help raise the child, except for an occasional ‘drive by’ SunshineSD day with daddy!(weekly, monthly…how often are you dropping by? Hehe)….am sorry, sunshine, but no
    matter how you crazily explain yourself, it doesn’t seem like a good idea. Also, there is more to raising a child than $$$$$….

  494. KatPaw says:

    *hit me with your best shot

    Ohh how I love auto correct

  495. KatPaw says:

    Ok all hot me with your best shot and opinions!!! Here we go got my seatbelt buckled
    1675157 is my profile

  496. KatPaw says:


    I didn’t call them rules he did… Just facts.. I’m very up front and honest. I don’t pretend to be anything but who I really and and no need to say I’ll do something that’s not pleasurable to me as well. I was surprised by his attitude considering his profile..

    Hmmm maybe I should look back over my profile make sure it doesn’t scream something I don’t want it too!

  497. SunShineSD says:

    May not be as crazy as you think 😉
    Notice GTT’s date was complaining about income from SA being unreliable. The way to get consistent income from a man of substance is really quite simple, it’s not sex per se but . . . much to the consternation of the fakes and wannabes.

  498. Josh says:

    Now that the “king” has laid down the detailed gameplan right down to the turkey baster, is it time time kiss the ring and pledge allegiance? 😉

  499. Kms2014 says:

    @sunshineSD…you may be real, but know you are really crazy 😉 hehe

  500. KatPaw says:


    Anal can be very very pleasurable when done right.. Some woman prefer it over vaginal sex even.. But I have medical reasons that usually makes it impossible to be pleasurable for me. Plus if your not into it your not into it!

  501. JamieSB says:

    @ Kat
    Oh sorry to hear about that!!
    And good on you for making rules. Girl gotta do what a girl gotta do : )
    I particularly hate anal!! Yukk

  502. KatPaw says:

    I probably have more rules then a “public pool” because this “pool” isn’t public but private and very selective! Lmao that’s how I should of responded.

  503. KatPaw says:


    He asked., I answered truthfully.. He is quite a distance from me too. It’s not that I don’t give head because I do lol been told quite well too.. I don’t swallow because it literally makes me sick.. That’s just embarrassing and gross.

  504. SunShineSD says:

    Not sure if it wise to go into the details before meeting. My last SB said she wasn’t into giving head when we did it the first time, and I kept her for over a year and half, and probably would have been longer if not for her getting pregnant with someone else. If she had told me she wasn’t into oral before meeting, there probably would not have been a meeting. I tend not to discuss any details like that before meeting, also for legal reasons; besides, if I’m not turned out when meeting the person for dinner, a lot of the procedural discussions for after dinner activities would be quite unnecessary. LOL.

  505. KatPaw says:

    @ Jamie

    Thought this up coming weekend till talking to pot more.. He said I have “more rules then a public pool”. Lmfao all because I want protection worn, anal just isn’t my thing , I’m not bi ohh and I don’t swallow! Lmfao oh well to bad so sad!

  506. SunShineSD says:

    Thank you for sharing your experience. In your QA session, did you inquire what her buy-out option is? I’d think if she says $4-5k/mo, that means she is at most pulling in $3k or so after expenses. Young people working stressful jobs are not good accountants. Of course, then you have to make a decision if it is worth your money buying out her other options, and make her exclusive to you, even for a $2-3k/mo outlay. If you really like everything else about her except for what she does to make ends meet, would you consider offering her a couple months vacation/break from her side job? Keep in mind though, if she has been doing her side job for a long time and if she is drug-dependent, she will likely flake out on you. There is something about people in that line of work unable to sticking to even legit business agreements; perhaps that line of work reconfigures their brains like PTSD and drugs do.

    It is sad to see the young generation so deprived of entry level jobs that many of them have few other options; it’s either selling his body to the military or selling her body to . . . welcome to the medieval world!

  507. JamieSB says:

    Thank you miss Kat : )
    Any pot dates for you? : )

  508. KatPaw says:


    Good luck on your coffee dates!!

  509. JamieSB says:

    @ KatPaw

  510. KatPaw says:

    Good morning sugars!

  511. SunShineSD says:

    I’m not big on publicity. As for as SB’s, many girls struggling in their lives are actually quite intelligent, just never had the opportunity to put their wits to especially high return investments. That’s the unfortunate consequence of generational poverty. I’m trying to break that cycle for her.

  512. SunShineSD says:


    I heard of that Indian guy. No idea how he keeps his 38 wives happy at all time. I’m not a big fan of communal living. The mothers can form their own community groups if they wish, my thinking is more along the lines of multiple independent households spread across a metropolitan area, so the outsiders wouldn’t even be able to tell what’s going on.

    Put it another way, in Medieval context for analogy, I’m not shooting for the Eastern model of big Imperial harem, but the European model of small Royal court plus royal off-springs outside the court. The royal off-springs outside the court were well taken care of by the mothers and subsidies from the court; and the royal mistresses would be especially marriageable material after her stint with the king thanks for the subsidies and potential promotional favors from the court for the husbands and subsequent children.

  513. JamieSB says:

    @ gtt
    I can see the girl’s point of view and sadly there is a very fine line between SD/SB arrangement and escort!!
    Have you any new date ?
    Still no sex for my Pot SD whom I was seeing
    for 2 months ; )
    Have 5 coffee dates this week including 1 today and they all seem very very promising… 2 already asked for exclusivity which I’m considering..
    let’s keep fingers crossed and see!!

  514. gtt_envy says:

    Met a potential last night and in my boredom of waiting was on e.c.c.i.e and who do I see? A profile with her in it.

    We talked for 2 hrs and what I gathered from her is sa.com is a very unreliable source for any real “income”. She told more story after story of the times she was scammed, stiffed, sd’s that magically disappeared.

    She said being selective and screening has been far more profitable.Once we really got candid she was fine with 1hr for $250 a discount from normal. I said I wasn’t interested feels transactional.

    She said she works about 5hrs/wk and does 4-5k a month. Many are repeats and while she wishes she could find a SD she said its too much work to find anyone reliable, so she opted for the escort world.

    Upon further reflection there might have been some fellacio involved lol. Skilled as she should be……still not my thing, but actually fun playing q/a with her.

    I asked how many other girls does she know doing that. She said 3-4 20 and big college town….who would have thought.

  515. SunShineSD says:

    I’m very real. Do the math: the cost of raising a kid at 10x the national average for child support per month works out to be close to $1Mil over a couple decades, with miscellaneous support and my own time on top of that. In contrast, considering Sterling bragged in his previous court deposition about what mind-blowing sex he was getting in his limo for $500, the marginal value of sexual gratification doesn’t really go up much with income. At that rate, 3 times a month (skipping that time of the month) works out to be only $18k in a year; not saying that’s the limit on what an SB gets for her time but the hypothetical cash value of the sex itself. Even for a relationship lasting 3-5 years, the cash value of the sex component itself is a tiny fraction of the cost of raising the kid in my system. So yes, if the candidate offers exceptionally high maternal genetics, sex can be optional. I would probably opt for someone who has so much of her own that my offer of 10x national average child support per month is not even much of a motivator compared to her own income so long as she can keep working her own career. What I put on the table would just be a safety net and umbrella policy for her to take some time out for the kid if she wishes.

  516. SunShineSD says:

    LOL. Don’t forget the DNA test requirement.

  517. SouthernSB says:

    Good morning sugars, hope you have a good day. Yes I am an early riser. But then again I am on the East Coast.

  518. SouthernSB says:

    Don’t forget you have to get one woman from all of the big four ethnic groups in the country, or it’ll just look like you are practicing eugenics. May I suggest, one black woman, one Hispanic, one east Indian, and one Asian. That way you can make your “perfect” society and no one is left out.

  519. Elaine says:

    @ All SD TV producers:

    Don’t let this opportunity pass, here’s a great format for a new television show!
    To be called “Sunshine Baby’s Farm”.

    With live camera report of his sperm, packed with genius genes, in the race for
    “The Egg”
    Bookmakers will stand in line to place bets!
    The whole nation will be breathless in front of to televisions!
    Kim Kardashian will be begging to be a guest star!

    Unfortunately, what the poor swimmers not yet know is that the prize almost certainly is of inferior quality….

    The producer is a young, spineless, female loser, easily influenced by her equally hopeless friends..Sunshine even had to rescue her from a drug addict,-dealing, x box playing, layabout boyfriend!

    Not exactly the right genetic maternital material for future geniuses … 🙁

  520. JamieSB says:

    @ SunshineSD
    You remind me of a guy in India somewhere who has 38 wives and about 100 children and total household of 160 something people, all under one roof. They have their private school and community ground.
    Should check that out : )

  521. flyR says:

    @ Sun

    Understanding the purity of your mission, I’ll potentially volunteer to serve as the bioingestible turkey baster .

  522. Kms2014 says:

    Seriously, are you for real, or a teen just having fun on internet? This is really funny, hehe….

  523. SunShineSD says:

    LOL. For the right genetic material on the maternal side, I’d be willing to allow indirect method if that’s what she wishes. The standards would have to be extraordinarily high. OTOH, since no sex is involved, I’d be free to be in a monogamous relationship with someone else at the same time. Comes to think of it, if I start to run out of time fulfilling my quota, this is a decent way of having more children without having to cut short an existing monogamous relationship to start a new one.

  524. flyR says:

    @sunshine “Turkey baster insemination is fine with me,” AYFKM If I am going to have a child I want to have launched the little critters on their best man wins run for the roses. I was not ready for the co-parenting arrangement but my perception is that it includes joint custody and joint responsibility. I wish I could say more but a wonderful SB but not at the right time .

  525. Josh says:


    I wonder if it is getting bites but it’s different alright. 😉

  526. KatPaw says:

    Southern I’m a non paying member and have 10 photos or so.. You should be able to add more photos.. When I looked at your profile you only had one pic up..

    @ Josh
    Longest profile ever.. Lol I doubt many end up reading the entire thing..

  527. SouthernSB says:

    Your “babyfarm” would make a great social experiment. You should shop it to producers. I’m sure people would tune in every week just to see what would happen next. After all people tune in to see both the Duggars and the Kardashians and what you are proposing seems like a hybrid of both.

  528. SouthernSB says:

    So I have to upgrade? I have to wait to do that next month. I have terrible bills and my finances are a mess. Oh well, I can wait one month.

  529. SunShineSD says:

    Interesting . . . I don’t mind paying substantial child support every month for that kind of Co-Parenting if the mother is well qualified. I wouldn’t even ask her to sign away rights of pursuing child support from me. I would have to have joint legal custody so that in case the mother is incapacitated the child will come to me for physical custody instead of the mother’s parents or partner. I can see that package appealing to high achieving single women who really want to be a parent, essentially recruiting me as a solid backup plan for her child in case she becomes incapacitated during pregnancy or after birth. Like I said, the woman has to be very well qualified in quite a few departments in order for me to put out (substantial money) without getting laid in return; LOL. Of course the child will be DNA tested by my choice of testing facility. Still debating about whether I want a chase-camera view on the swimmers on their way from the Turkey baster to meet their eggy destination. LOL. Turkey baster insemination is fine with me, but not the needle work artificial insemination because I prefer the child be created by a good swimmer sperm not a lazy and easy to capture sperm; plus, I don’t want multiple-births beyond an occasional twin.

  530. Josh says:

    SouthernSB you need more pictures.

  531. Josh says:

    If you want to see one of the more interesting profiles I have read then go to the “Sugar for a Cause” article and check out the profile number in the post by Halcyon.

  532. SouthernSB says:

    At least you are getting bites. No one will even smile at me.

  533. flyR says:

    @Sunshine SD Co-Parenting was the phrase that escaped me at the time. The mother and child stay together. My problem is that as described the turkey baster gets all the fun. The one I met was one of the more devoted mothers I have run into. I’m enough of a traditionalist to think it has a strange feel but she was a able to bring the father into the process.

  534. KatPaw says:

    Evening sugarrrrs.. Hope you are all having more luck then I lately.. I seem to have the pot poofs! Lol

  535. Josh says:


    That’s why they say TPOTPIITE. 😉

  536. SunShineSD says:

    I’m not FLDS. I prefer the children to follow the mothers’ religions or lack of religion, so they do not all have the same religion.

    Spreading legs would be a lot less expensive than having children and spreading wealth.

  537. SouthernSB says:

    Are you FLDS?

  538. SunShineSD says:

    There is no “baby farm” per se either. I mentioned to Zack before, I’m willing to forgo the economy of scale, and pay extra to give each mother-baby pair a separate house to live in, just so that the child will grow up with a sense of independence. They will just live like any other divorced parent raising a child, except for with significantly more financial resources at their disposal than typical single parent families.

  539. Josh says:

    @SouthernSB, @Kms2014

    This is what I have gathered so far from months of baby farm posts.

    Our resident self proclaimed high net worth, “alpha” male who allegedly lasts for hours chasing and wearing his woman down on every flat and not so flat surface in the house.

    So he needs the youngest available women to pound for hours and hopefully insemanate them when he is ready. He is more interested in popping of babies and not necessarily the pooping part.

    He wants to busy himself with the banging and popping babies for the next 20 years and will then round up the crop for the next phase of the project when he is 60.

    I will share additional insight when I can wrap my head around the other data provided from the carrier of the alleged superior gene that needs spreading.

    Methinks that, as Kms2014 suggested, it’s more about spreading of the legs than the spreading of his “superior” genes. However, because he subscribes to certain philosophical thought, he concocted the baby farm idea.

  540. SunShineSD says:

    I’m not sure what contract-parenting movement is. If it means a contract that bypasses marriage but go straight to co-parenting for two people who want the child like in a amicable divorce, then I’d be very interested. If it means something like surrogacy, I’m not sure if that’s the most healthy thing for the child, or even the mother after she goes through the typical surrogacy fee like a lottery win. I want the mother to receive long term support, and have higher standards on herself after becoming a mother.

  541. Kms2014 says:

    Thank you for that review in biology, sunshine 😉 I realise the risks are higher after this age, but women still have very healthy babies, after 35…even, in 40’s. I am the product of an ‘after 35 birth’…am quite normal….well, that is up for debate! Hehe!

    By the way, SunshineSD are you completely crazy, like ‘mad scientist’ with a baby making laboratory, in your basement? Lol

  542. SunShineSD says:

    The risk of Down Syndrome increase dramatically after about 35. Unlike sperms that are produced throughout the carrier’s life, a women’s eggs are there on the shelf from the beginning of her life. There are a number of risks to both the woman and the child when trying to give birth late in life. Let’s also not forget, there’s a period of dating and pregnancy before giving birth. I would not impregnate someone if she is still indulging in habits that are harmful to children or risky to her pregnancy. All these factors combined result in a relatively early age requirement.

    As for child support number, I think I mentioned the 10x – 30x national average for child support. That alone is sufficient to put the woman and child in the middle class to upper middle class in terms of income. Hopefully the woman will also build a career of her own on top of my support base, in fields that she enjoys.

    Part of the purpose of the program is to avoid state support. The woman is going to be pregnant by someone some day, and on her current trajectory would likely be a loser BF and end up putting her on welfare, which is conditional upon her not accumulating any capital. That’s how generational poverty is created. I would be taxed to pay for the bill anyway. So instead of that, I’m seeking to give both the mother and the child an opportunity to enter middle class and upper middle class productive life style, with money that otherwise would mostly gone to pay into taxes anyway to support dysfunction and dependency instead.

  543. Josh says:

    Hello sweetie. Good to see you again. 🙂

  544. SouthernSB says:

    It should really say “cops TRY to rescue strippers and prostitutes all the time. They are big ones for a “good girl gone bad with a hard luck story.” At times they even marry them. Hey cops, the original white knight SD.

  545. aliceS says:

    RSD every profile sounds like this. I’m down to earth blah blah blah, like one person on sa create every sb profiles, lol. This is madness

  546. SunShineSD says:

    Great to see you back!
    I don’t mind baby popping desires. I just don’t want to get married again.

  547. aliceS says:

    Shanelle you look awesome, and daaaaaaaat ass, dammit, this is the main reason I regret my mother had me with my father. Dammit, you rock girl!!!!!!

  548. Kms2014 says:

    SoutherSB…what woman wants to be ‘rescued’ and put into a baby making farm? Really? That, in itself, is worse than prison, prostitution or stripping, hehehe 😉

  549. RSD says:

    @ Shanelle, basically I like your profile, but poor grammar for me is a big turn-off; a girl who can compose a nice paragraph or two is much more likely to captivate both my mind and penis.

  550. RSD says:

    Shanelle, this is how I’d edit your profile:

    I’m a 22 year-old college student looking to try something new and different. I’m very open minded and down to earth. I love music, traveling, poetry, reading, and going out with close friends and family. Yet, I feel like the there is so much to see and do in this world, and I’d love for a gentleman to take me out of my comfort zone and show me something new.

    I’m not just looking to be spoiled and give nothing in return; it’s not just about what you can do for me but what we can do for one another. I want a mutually beneficial intimate friendship that is not purely about sex. I’m new to this SB/SD thing, but if you’re interested, let’s chat.

  551. SouthernSB says:

    Cops “rescue” strippers and prostitues all the time. So I can understand SunshineSD’s need to want to rescue young women from their plight. What I don’t understand is exactly where on SA is SunshineSD going to find naive, really young girls (in fact I hesitate to call anyone on SA “girls” because it just sounds too creepy). Most of the women on SA if not mature, are at very least, goal oriented, and not easily impressed.

  552. flyR says:

    If you are looking to have children there’s contract parenting which I’m sure is available with a direct deposit option. One of the spokeswomen for the movement could certainly hold her own among the well educated, attractive 30s SB’s here.

  553. Kms2014 says:

    Hey sweetie! Glad you are back (:


  554. Kms2014 says:

    Prefer banging young 20 something’s, of course….29 is much too old to have babies, ehehe!

  555. Kms2014 says:

    So, over 35 doesn’t have the option of having babies? Lol! Spin it all you want, but just say that you prefer banging 29 something’s. How much child support do you plan allocating to all these women, by the way? Since, you are always speaking of SB’s and their poor financial decision making skills, in regards to long-term goals…do, pray tell, do you plan on supporting all these various baby mamas, in your olden/golden years? Ehehe! Doesn’t seem the smartest retirement plan, or morally right, in my opinion. But hey, maybe they can get on state benefits, if you default on their child support.

  556. sweetie says:

    Hello everyone! How are you all doing?
    Beach Girl, hi dear!

    @Sunshine ” I’m not sure it’s fair to take up 2-3 years time of a 30+ yo with a busy career and biological clock ticking loudly wanting to get married.”
    Why do guys assume women in their 30s are all baby/bridezilla ticking bombs? So tired of hearing about it. Not every woman is obsessed and desperate to land a husband and pop out babies. This stereotype surely hurts the dating options, though.

  557. SunShineSD says:

    You can email me at my disposable email address: NESunshineSD at gmail

  558. MidwestSugarDaddy says:

    @SunShineSD I had seen some selfish behavior from my prior SB. She made a request that was outside the scope of our arrangement. I ignored the request and got the entitlement attitude.

    It is funny that you mention friends. This request was clearly an idea from her less than intelligent friend. This friend is a train wreck, which is also a red flag for my prior SB. A lack of friends was also a red flag for this former SB.

    After a little while, I realized that the only thing this former SB really had going for her was looks. She was a 7-7.5 but the attitude dropped her a point in my book. The true self is always revealed in time. The final ending was pretty epic. Typical entitlement behavior doomed her. There are details that I would not want out there because it was unique. Admins, please provide my email to SunShineSD.

  559. SunShineSD says:

    I think I explained this before. At the time when I decided on the 24yo (just before turning 25, now she is 27), the other option was a 22yo. I thought I’d be able to make a bigger difference in the 24yo’s life as she was barely starting her higher education whereas the 22yo was starting the last year of her Master’s program. I over-estimated my wattage, partly because unlike the previous SB’s, the 24yo was nearly two hours drive away and we couldn’t be together often enough; her life became a mystery to me, and not in a good way.

  560. SunShineSD says:

    @Southern @KMS

    I was not complaining. I was responding to a post by MidWest, where he seemed to have a moment of glee over his ex-SB facing hardship after breaking up. It’s an understandable emotion after being hurt. I was just pointing out that there might have been mitigating circumstances for what she did; the SB probably had a bunch of loser friends egging her on. She simply didn’t know better.

    I’m not dating women over 35 right now because I’m barely 40 myself, and still have the option of making more babies of the crawling variety. I intend to focus on the kids after turning 60, so all the kids will have graduated college and have started a career when I pass from this world. Consequently, I have this 20yr window right now to produce enough kids to keep me occupied after I turn 60. I have no problem with young but emotionally mature and goal oriented women. I dated them previously, even married one. The divorce came about largely because my ex-wife could not have more children and we decided to divorce while she was still young enough to remarry.

  561. Kms2014 says:

    @southern…sunshine man doesn’t want older women, or even women who are young, but mature, goal oriented and not easily impressed….he wants really young and naive girls, who want to be part of his baby farm. Uses excuse off ‘saving’ or ‘rescuing’ women to justify his desires, hehe 😉 have you ever heard these excuses before, in regards to justifying certain behaviours? Hehehe!

  562. SouthernSB says:

    If you’re tired of dating what you call immature college girls, why don’t you just get a SB who is in her late mid to late 40’s. Most of the time these women aren’t running to the alter because they have already been divorced and they don’t want to do it again (been there done that wrote the book) and they are headlong on their way to God’s own birth control or they already have kids so they aren’t pushing the “I need one NOW” button. It’s not like women turn into sexless crones once they hit 40, and a lot of women aren’t all that successful in their 40’s due to the fact that they didn’t make the best decisions in their 20’s and now they are trying to reinvent themselves by going back to college and getting their lives together. These women would be mega-grateful for the attentions of a SD, and the financial support one could give. Remember, as the recession hurt a lot of men and they had to go back to school to reinvent themselves at 50, women had to do the same thing. The average age of a McDonald’s worker is 23, and Walmart pays so little that the day they hire you they also give you an application to apply for Medicaid and Snap. So, if you started dating women your own age and gave up the 20 somethings, you might be surprised by the fact that these women who go to community college are quite mature, grateful for any little bit they get, ready to pamper and most of all far from entitled and self-absorbed.

  563. Shanelle says:

    Thanks…. Definitely taking notes

  564. Kms2014 says:

    Very good advice, flyR (:

  565. flyR says:

    following on KMS

    Take blank sheet and list
    what’s special about you that is relevant to the target SD
    how will you change the SD’s life
    what’s important to you in your sd – what’s disqualifying

    Do the text portions in word and then run spell and grammar checks

    There’s a lot of talk about hours to prepare for the first meeting nails, hair, eyes etc. This is far more important as it is your introduction.

    I’m a fan of Steven Pressfield’s The Authentic Swing and although it’s far from sugar the idea is the same be the best of what you are. There’s no purpose served in posing as a rock groupie if you are really a rocket scientist.

  566. Kms2014 says:

    Grammatical errors* ironic, since I’m lecturing about grammar! ehehe!

  567. Kms2014 says:

    I mean, what is your target market, ideally? You have very pretty look, and your profile isn’t bad, but there are some grammar errors that can be easily fixed. Also, profile is good, in that you mention not looking to be treated as a princess and want something ‘mutual’ but description is a little generic, and ‘vague’, in that it is not very ‘inviting’, but this also depends on what you are seeking…

  568. Shanelle says:


    Jus a little advice… a few pointers on my profile

  569. Shanelle says:



  570. Kms2014 says:

    Hi Shanelle,

    What sort of help would you like? (:

  571. flyR says:

    “Actually, not to offend college girls, since there are many who make up their own minds as well…I tried to ignore most of my girlfriends’ unsolicited opinions, even in college, because I did not want to live someone else’s life.”

    Sadly most (but certainly not all) college students have lived a terribly insular life, especially in today’s world of student loans, which have replaced the saving for school, summer and part time jobs and living lean. As my nephew (chm econ dept at major univ) noted there’s no topic too trivial for a knives out faculty fight and the political foundation of the vast majority of faculty members is far out of touch with reality.

    The poster child for this entitled anarchy was the woman who demanded the university pay for first class contraception, not the lower quality used by those who pay the taxes to support the institution.

    The sugar connection is that it can be a relationship which provides reality based north star guidance in the real world when that’s part of the selection process.

  572. SunShineSD says:

    P* was parenthetically brought up only as part of an income quality specification for “success” because we had previous been using only quantity of income as line for what passes for a modicum of success. People engaged in P* can easily beat that line, but the quality of that particular income stream is low for reasons mentioned above. I don’t consider SA a venue for P*; otherwise, I wouldn’t be here.

  573. KatPaw says:

    *For interrupting

  574. KatPaw says:


    Never be sorry for I tutoring any silly debate on here especially when asking for help.

    First off you’re beautiful! Pictures are one major key to profiles.. Smile look happy and chose flattering pics… ( ditch the bathing suit pic it does you no justice )
    Now make sure you talk about what you can do for him.. How do you make him want you what are you going to do for him.. Remember you are marketing yourself to someone else..

  575. SunShineSD says:

    *making even more.

  576. SunShineSD says:

    Not sure where you got the idea that I assume all women make little money. Many women in my regular business context make more than $50k; quite a few actually over $100k. Overwhelming majority of them have husbands or boyfriends even more. Among the lower income women that I have come in contact with, the rate of them keeping loser boy toys is actually higher. This phenomenon is actually reflected in much broader statistics: the high networth population is something like 80+% male, whereas among the 20-something year olds male unemployment rate is much higher than that of the female population.

    Starting pays in many if not most industries were higher in 1999 than they are today.

    BTW, like I mentioned before, I have no moral objection to p* (a woman owns her own body, therefore has every right to sell it). The problem with p* is the lack of security, especially long term career security. We all whore our time and potentially health to some client/customer/boss. It’s what we get to keep in return that matters. The p* career has the quirk that the highest earning years are short and taking place before the person is mature enough to manage the high earnings into an enduring profit generating asset base for later years. . . a bit like child movie star with no prospect of becoming a regular movie star 20 years later with even higher pay from doing the same job. Then again, many staff IT jobs and entry level finance jobs are becoming like that too with knowledge obsolescence and near-zero pension build-up. LOL.

  577. Shanelle says:

    Hey guys sorry to interrupt. New to this and need major help with my profile.
    Good and bad feedback plz.

  578. Kms2014 says:

    And many times, my female friends making this amount, 10 years ago, were not trying to ‘marry up’. Several, if not many, married men their own age, similar backgrounds and in similar points in their careers. They were trying to marry someone they loved, and have similar beliefs and moral compass to. It isn’t all about ‘marrying up’ or having an xbox boyfriend, whom they support. There are women who don’t want, or need to marry up, or a SD to save them.

  579. Kms2014 says:

    ” Women actually having achieved a modicum of success making $50k or more (from real jobs, not from prostitution) actually tend to work on their marrying up schemes, and understand the need to leverage another source of more than 100% of her own income to beat the Joneses (still a waste but . . .) LOL.”

    What do you consider prostitution? What they are doing with you, on SA, or a different sort of prostitution? You think it is rare for women to not make more than $50,000 a year in their careers, or even first few positions? You haven’t been in the workforce in awhile, it seems 😉 I knew women in Finance and IT, starting at $45,000(plus, commissions)-$70,000 back 10 years ago….

  580. SunShineSD says:


    I too am surprised at how many a young woman has been brainwashed into thinking that keeping a drug-addicted xbox-playing boy toy is a mark of success and independence like driving a luxury car or having a 3500sqft starter McMansion when she doesn’t have the means yet. The loan officer would step in and stop her from going over her head and get the house burden, but there is no one standing in her way of throwing her life away with a loser that she keeps like a puppy/cat except costing much much more. This is a remarkably common phenomenon among young woman making $30k or less on their first or second real jobs. Women actually having achieved a modicum of success making $50k or more (from real jobs, not from prostitution) actually tend to work on their marrying up schemes, and understand the need to leverage another source of more than 100% of her own income to beat the Joneses (still a waste but . . .) LOL.

    BTW, it’s not about genes but about providing a healthy middle class environment for the kids that many a she would have someday anyway, statistically speaking.

  581. Kms2014 says:

    @Elaine, ehehe! 😉

  582. KatPaw says:

    Happy Monday sugars!

  583. elaine says:

    “I am deciding between dating a mature and successful woman in real life vs. picking up less mature and most certainly less successful woman on SA. Considering that I have no intention of marrying anyone again, I’m not sure it’s fair to take up 2-3 years time of a 30+ yo with a busy career and biological clock ticking loudly wanting to get married”

    Hypothetical question;

    What succesful, mature woman needs to be “saved” from drug addicted / dealing / x box playing B.F. and would want to be parked in Sunshines “babyfarm” to take part of his brilliant gene spreading program?

  584. Kms2014 says:

    And the fact you think women prefer to surround themselves with other women ‘lesser’ than themselves, so that they can feel superior and maternal? That is most definitely nonsensical..lol.

  585. Kms2014 says:

    SunshineSD…the point isn’t that you prefer young college cuties, which you obviously do, to mature women, in their 30’s or 40’s(although, many in this age group are NOT looking for marriage and/or babies). Also, many SB on SA, who are older than 20’s are certainly not looking for this, hehe! The point was/is that you lump women into this weak minded viewpoint, in that you said…

    ” The typical woman is prone to surround herself with people lesser than herself so she can feel superior and “maternal.” The same loser “friends” of course grasp at the opportunity getting back at her, putting down any and all opportunities that we SD’s offer her just because those loser “friends” can’t find sponsors themselves. In that environment, it must be quite hard for the SB to grasp the true value of the
    opportunities that we offer.”

    Umm, no…not all women need their friends to tell them what to do. And no…not all women that are against SD/SB relationships are that way, due to not being able to find a SD themselves. Some women would never be involved in this lifestyle…and some are really young and hot, but have other goals in mind, than being saved by the sunshine man.

  586. JamieSB says:

    Just unhide my profile and got approximately 20 new messages : /
    Secure coffee dates with 4 promising SDs : )
    Hope everyone has a good and full of sugar week : )
    So cold in this side of the world!! First few days of winter!! : (

  587. Beach_Girl says:

    Hello sugars

    There are many SBs in the real world. I would think that the women that was with Sterling wasn’t on the list, she is such a disgrace, imo. She recorded him and probably got paid to do so by people that wanted him out! Anyways, she has no integrity or morals to record someone and then let the tapes leak out… Discretion is a must and most forget about that. She should of learned the do’s and don’ts of being a SB

    Kat~ I hear you on friend becoming family, I’m like that too 😀

    Hope you all have a great day 😀

  588. JamieSB says:

    @ SunshineSD
    I hear you! I myself am surprised with the amount of mature SBs here. Though I don’t think 30 – 40 year old is mature? Also depends on individual as well!! Some late 30s or older ladies look amazing and some 20s are just shocking!
    But each to their own obviously ; )

  589. SunShineSD says:

    BTW, I’m not looking for a mature and successful women on SA because I do not aspire to be a male SB myself. I am deciding between dating a mature and successful woman in real life vs. picking up less mature and most certainly less successful woman on SA. Considering that I have no intention of marrying anyone again, I’m not sure it’s fair to take up 2-3 years time of a 30+ yo with a busy career and biological clock ticking loudly wanting to get married.

  590. SunShineSD says:

    If the girl had been humble and receptive of advice from people with more experience, she would not have surrounded herself with losers for friends. It’s precisely the losers’ inability to give any good advice and never being able to say “I told you so” that make the losers especially appealing as “friends” on an emotional level. Yet, at critical times in life, background noises do matter. The quality of that background noise has to be built in pre-crisis times.

  591. Kms2014 says:

    Actually, not to offend college girls, since there are many who make up their own minds as well…I tried to ignore most of my girlfriends’ unsolicited opinions, even in college, because I did not want to live someone else’s life. In fact, had a male friend who was worse about giving me an opinion on what I should or should not do. Some young women are not the helpless, easily influenced, weak-minded persons that some think 😉

  592. Kms2014 says:

    “Now you have our interest piqued. Please do spill the beans on some details. The way I see it, the insincere SB’s have fairly tough lives. The typical woman is prone to surround herself with people lesser than herself so she can feel superior and “maternal.” The same loser “friends” of course grasp at the opportunity getting back at her, putting down any and all opportunities that we SD’s offer her just because those loser “friends” can’t find sponsors themselves. In that environment, it must be quite hard for the SB to grasp the true value of the opportunities that we offer. Walking away is probably the right approach to help her mature quicker.”

    Oh gosh, really? Where do you get this stuff? Stop playing in the sandbox at the college campus, if you want a mature and successful woman, who doesn’t care what others think…sheesh, so tired of men acting like women cannot make up their own minds without their ‘girlfriends’ input. Not all women are mindless, weak drug addicted without the guidance and help of a SD to ‘save’ or ‘bail’ them out. Maybe, some see it as such, since they fancy themselves as a knight riding in to save the day. But, then complain continuously, when they get used and abused by the same type of woman each time. I have had male friends like this, in the past. But, in the end, he would pick the drama filled, bimbo, immature girl each time, over the stable, more emotionally and economically responsible woman…

  593. KatPaw says:

    I have very few close female and male friends truthfully.. I’m careful of the people I let in… My friends become family to me.. I have a huge heart so it can easily be used and abused.. I may not have much but it’s more then others..

  594. SunShineSD says:


    Now you have our interest piqued. Please do spill the beans on some details. The way I see it, the insincere SB’s have fairly tough lives. The typical woman is prone to surround herself with people lesser than herself so she can feel superior and “maternal.” The same loser “friends” of course grasp at the opportunity getting back at her, putting down any and all opportunities that we SD’s offer her just because those loser “friends” can’t find sponsors themselves. In that environment, it must be quite hard for the SB to grasp the true value of the opportunities that we offer. Walking away is probably the right approach to help her mature quicker.

    BTW, this toxic “support network” that many women have may also explain why some women are perceived to be actively sabotaging relationships. They are simply egged on by their “friends” (really competitors in the mating game) to carry out bad behavior and bite the hand that feeds.

  595. SunShineSD says:


  596. flyR says:


    ATNW – All talk no wallet
    WFSO – Wants Free Samples Only

    WSDL – Won SD Lottery

  597. aliceS says:

    Eloquence lol I just couldnt stop myself lmao

  598. Eloquence says:

    Senior discounts you say? Game of Champions. 🙂

  599. aliceS says:

    wtf is wrong with your shortcuts guys, i dont understand a thing, unless you say HIMYM, other than that not really. Maybe we need some of those as well

    Since more and more seniors are texting and tweeting there appears to be a need for a STC (Senior Texting Code).
    If you qualify for Senior Discounts, this is the code for you….
    ATD: At The Doctor’s
    BFF: Best Friend Fell
    BTW: Bring The Wheelchair
    BYOT: Bring Your Own Teeth
    CBM: Covered By Medicare
    CUATSC: See You At The SeniorCenter
    DWI: Driving While Incontinent
    FWB: Friend With Beta Blockers
    FWIW: Forgot Where I Was
    FYI: Found Your Insulin
    GGPBL: Gotta Go, Pacemaker Battery Low!
    GHA: Got Heartburn Again
    HGBM: Had Good Bowel Movement
    IMHO: Is My Hearing-Aid On?
    LMDO: Laughing My Dentures Out
    LOL: Living On Lipitor
    LWO: Lawrence Welk’s On
    OMMR: On My Massage Recliner
    OMSG: Oh My! Sorry, Gas.
    ROFL… CGU: Rolling On The Floor Laughing… And Can’t Get Up
    SGGP: Sorry, Gotta Go Poop
    TTYL: Talk To You Louder
    WAITT: Who Am I Talking To?
    WTFA: Wet The Furniture Again
    WTP: Where’s The Prunes?
    WWNO: Walker Wheels Need Oil
    LMGA: Lost My Glasses Again
    GGLKI: Gotta Go, Laxative Kicking In

  600. Eloquence says:

    rhetorical question: are they the same?

  601. Eloquence says:

    I am also versed in Pig Latin, that was how we wrote our penpal’s as children for fun. You know, the old art of writing a letter and sending it snail mail of pony express. Wait, isn’t the two contradictory of each other referencing the postal service?

  602. Eloquence says:

    @ Josh

    Yeay, It is my turn to say… I never understand what your are saying…. except for your earlier comment began I “think” with –

    your comment: Hmmm, I DNGTM that we HMOT the YMIS realm?

    and I gather: DNGTM = Did not get the memo – and then I have my own suggestions prior…

    Is this really conducive?

  603. Josh says:



  604. SouthernSB says:

    I have a man that is talking to me via messenger, he’s married (not that I care)and can only talk to me when the wife is away. So we’ve only talked a total of about 10 minutes. He has my phone number, and I think he just wants sex chat over the phone. I have no idea how to set up an arrangement with him, but I am having fun-even though I am a little frustrated.

  605. Josh says:


    You may be better of sticking with Paris to meet up, especially in the beginning, regardless of where the POTs are. Sometimes people are looking for a reason to go to the City to hang out.

  606. aliceS says:

    SouthernSB how’s your searches doing? Any interesting guys?

  607. aliceS says:

    Morning infidels 😉 so I was in contact with new sd from Paris? But then he told he isn’t from Paris, but he is from a village that is near me actually. I told him that it’s even better cause I’m only 2h from him, and that in Paris I am very rarely. Guess what. Contact died. No reponse what’s so ever. After 3 weeks of communication he just dumped me. 🙁

  608. SouthernSB says:

    Morning Sugars hope you are having a good and relaxing Sunday.
    I’m sorry your weekend didn’t work out, but there’s always next week. Heck I can’t even get anyone to look at me. 🙁
    Like the song says, “It’s in the kiss, that’s where it is, uh huh, uh huh!!” You can always tell how a woman feels by the way she kisses. As for the “princesses” maybe you should just screen for them and just delete all of them out. The only reason they think they are princesses anyway is because Disney and their mothers told them they were.

  609. KatPaw says:

    I wish! But doubt it! Lol

  610. DarkHorseSD says:

    @KatPaw…Wed and Thurs are Jewish holiday…he could make it by then?

  611. KatPaw says:


    Aww thank you!

  612. Doc says:

    Hope it works out for you KatPaw.

  613. KatPaw says:

    Thanks there is always tomorrow right.. Lol keeping hope it will work out. 🙂

  614. Josh says:


    Awww, sorry to hear that dear. 🙁

  615. KatPaw says:


    It seems things keep working agains pot getting here… Atm he stuck in Phoenix lol ohhhh and I was just thinking about you was going to email you in a bit.. Lol

  616. gtt_envy says:

    @Josh, have to agree with you from a few blogs back about the increase in profiles with the words paraphrased “Princess, spoil me, what I deserve” it is getting worse lol. Seems like every other profile says things like this nowadays.

    @MidwestSugarDaddy, I too have been swoon by a great body and beautiful smile, but those “selfish profiles” do foreshadow what is to come in most cases boo boo.


    Kiss passionately there is no clearer sign that someone isn’t into you then 60% effort while kissing. The latest was fun, but clearly this is a means to a end for her. She is sweet, nice, cute, etc etc but her true intentions are evident in the kiss.

    Previous arrangements ,at least the great ones, were all were really into that piece of the puzzle. Very passionate kissers, initiating kissing, and at times being the sexual aggressor it makes us happy lol.

    I think this one has run it’s course in my book!

  617. MidwestSugarDaddy says:

    @KatPaw I hope your potential wises up and makes it there for you.

    I will give you guys a good teaser. I did end up ditching my sugar baby a little while ago in epic fashion. The best part about the story was her getting stuck and me not having to pay her at all for this month. It was pretty funny and I am laughing to myself about the irony of it all. KatPaw helped me out and saw the evidence of the epic outcome of it all. Appreciate it.

    I had 2 potentials running in the background for the last month. I had met with one a couple of times. She seems promising, but we shall see. The main lesson I learned was that selfish profiles and entitlement behavior are a red flag. I had fun,, but I am glad to be moving on to greener pastures.

  618. JamieSB says:

    Thanks for the advice about New York. It’s definitely in my bucket list!!
    @ DarkHorseSD
    Thank you for your advice : ) will keep that in mind!
    @ KatPaw
    Aw sorry about the no sugar weekend : (

  619. Zack says:

    I think Josh mentioned he did a minor offense, but found out ex post facto. Not his fault, so there’s no record? Lol. So much for fast action. But perhaps he was just talking to himself; the acronyms are Greek to me.

    Flyr–not into nine inch nails? Alice–those things look dangerous 🙂
    Tori Amos, Precious Things: www youtube com/watch?v=Kpk_ZjdGPnE

    I did miss out on an attractive teacher in high school; that awkwardness in me I definitely regret.

  620. SouthernSB says:

    Same here.

  621. KatPaw says:

    :-/ not looking good for my weekend having some sugar in it..

  622. DarkHorseSD says:

    JamieSB said, “We have gone for heaps dinner and lunch and still no sex. No other money or allowance involved otherwise : )”

    I think you are supposed to have sex with him when you get horny enough, then maybe he helps pay your rent and stuff. That was the drift of what my friend was saying at dinner the other night, I think.

  623. Kms2014 says:

    The boy had Aspergers…it wasn’t as much about getting laid, or sex by an escort as it was about being an outcast (to both men and women). If you have ever known anyone will Aspergers, personally, then it makes more sense. Not that I am making an excuse for this boy(as most with this condition do not shoot people), but the solution was not as simple as buying a woman… I don’t think, anyway.

  624. SouthernSB says:

    I have to agree with you somewhat, the teenage boys and in some cases even the 17 year old girls do flirt with their teachers to a ridiculous degree. I have even seen and heard High School boys (from back in my day) talk about how they would do some of the younger more attractive teachers in my school. When I hear about some of these cases I just think “Haven’t I seen this in a Van Halen video?”
    And you are soooo right about that young man that shot up his college, there was nothing wrong with him that a weekend in Vegas or a good arraignment here on SA wouldn’t have cured. It’s a shame that people can know so much and still know so little. When you see your son needs to get laid you as a father need to help him out, it isn’t like the kid wasn’t attractive, it’s just that he was awkward and was swimming in a big pond. Honestly, if he were my son, I would have sent him to a small college in the Midwest or South where girls are impressed by boys who’s parents are in the industry.

  625. SouthernSB says:

    You should have taken the offer from the random multi-millionaire. New York is the greatest city in the world!! Not only was I born there, I spent the four greatest years of my life there going to college, making random income so I could just partying at the best clubs, wasting my Augusts in the Hamptons, visiting Tiffany’s so much the salespeople became my best friends (I couldn’t buy anything, I just looked at the diamonds and chilled with the sales staff) and having brunch at Macy’s. Now, don’t get me wrong I was not rich, in fact I worked in retail, but it was 30 years ago, and you could pretty much do all that on minimum wage, as long as you were living with your parents or in college, as long as you dressed to the nines and looked like you “belonged” there. Now, I don’t know how it is in the City now, with all the private clubs and lists, but in my time there wasn’t a velvet rope anywhere that could keep me out. If you ever get to New York, make sure your SD takes you out for one day of just “regular” people sightseeing because, and I hate to sound negative, you just never know if all those things will be there forever. Case in point, my mother, who lived in New York her whole life had never been to the top of the twin towers because she thought they would always be there, and then we had 9/11.

  626. Kms2014 says:

    Unless, the Brit wakes up with dry mouth while speaking…

  627. Kms2014 says:

    Nope, that is obvious humour, hehe 😉

  628. Josh says:

    I have heard from authentic sources that if you wake up a Brits in the middle of the night they speak like normal people. The fake accent is reserved for the daytime.

    Dry humour? 😉

  629. JamieSB says:

    @ Kms
    Yes 16 years old I went by myself to a country I couldn’t find on the world map and the language I knew nothing of!
    But it’s all good! Now I speak 3 languages!

  630. Kms2014 says:

    Ah, okay, well it’s great you went to Oz! My father offered me an exchange student program to there, when I was in high school, but I stupidly turned it down…

    Takes guts to move that far away, at your age….(:

  631. JamieSB says:

    @ Kms
    No I’m not from Oz at all : )

  632. Kms2014 says:

    Yes, and very tough to do. Good for you (: Are you not originally from Oz, then?

  633. JamieSB says:

    @ Kms
    Yes it was definitely interesting and worth it doing IB! I had great time!
    End of IB I was offered few college scholarships in US which I didn’t end up going. Very glad I chose Australia though. FYI majority of my high school mate ended up being doctor so yes it’s a doorway to some good colleges and universities!!

  634. Kms2014 says:

    Oh wow, yes….half Spanish. Nice (:

    I taught a-level business and travel tourism(which, is ironic because I haven’t traveled very much, and not anywhere there when I started teaching, haha!).

    That is interesting about IB. That is great degree! I never knew about IB, until I lived over, in UK, and started looking at other schools, like the American schools there, since I wasn’t happy with the UK curriculum…is very different to US, but is good learning experience. Anyway, my son is the overachiever type, and told him about IB, and now he has finished his first year at an IB program. He loves it, since all the kids are like-minded academically, and is pretty cool, since not as many American kids do it. Were you happy you did the IB, looking back now? I know it gets hard, once they really get into the program the last two years….It is great, if you want to attend Uni in UK, or anywhere, really, though (((:

  635. JamieSB says:

    @ Kms
    Oh wow A level!! I m wondering what subjects did you teach?
    I’m always curious about A level and other high school equivalent program! I completed IB in Europe a while back and it was a unique experience!
    Can definitely relate to the ‘cold’ person comment as I was in England for a while and also dated one. He was half Brit half Spanish and God so hot!! Haha
    Melbourne is a great city!!!

  636. Kms2014 says:

    Melbourne…have heard really great things about that place (:

  637. Kms2014 says:

    @Jaime…I was teaching A-levels there, so was around mainly students and Teachers, while there….to be honest, I liked a few of the teachers, and have made a few great friends that am still in contact with and see, occasionally, but many(including students) were grumpy and negative…they are a little more of a ‘cold’ people, until you get to know them, but I am in southern US, so I am used to people being super duper friendly(even, if that is only ‘fake’ facade, sometimes). Overall, I love their ironic, dry wit, and learned they most just take a longer time to warm up to you, but are not fake.

    Forgive me, if any Brits are on here…I wasn’t there that long, so what do I know 😉

  638. JamieSB says:

    I agree the blog is not a good pick up place as it creates awkwardness if one tries and other reject. Also distance blah blah
    Having said that, I still express my crush for sir Richard here! Haha

  639. JamieSB says:

    @ Kms
    I live in Melbourne it’s the best city ; )
    I love a British gent!! Dated one few year back!
    I studied in UK many many years back but wasn’t impressed with people and the weather there!!
    How do you like it there?

  640. Kms2014 says:

    For SD who just want college cuties 20 minutes away, then yes, why bother seeking long distance. However, in regards to some very important businessmen…they are away from home, more often than not, so they have no problem with long distance, or flying someone to their current location. In fact, the value added is that they ‘can’ do this.

  641. SunshineSD says:

    I thought the blog is a no – pickup zone, especially for SD’s, due to the likelihood of very long distance. Dozens of colleges within 20 miles of my location provide much better odds. OTOH, for someone else located in the middle of nowhere, I suppose the perspective could be different.

  642. Kms2014 says:

    Oh no, I actually prefer one, if all needs are being met. Unless, I get bored and just want a little excitement, here and there. But, I do get bored easily, hehe.

    G’day, by the way 😉 What part of Oz do you live? Almost moved to NZ years ago, but ended up in UK instead.

  643. JamieSB says:

    @ Kms
    One good arrangement is better than a few not as good arrangement right?
    Hope it gets better miss : )

  644. Josh says:

    Ah, alas…you unwittingly fell for the game. 🙁

  645. JamieSB says:

    @ Josh
    Not sure who you are pointing that to but ok I’ll keep that in mind.
    Regarding blog pick up:
    Not trying to pick up anyone here but I have a blog crush on Richard haha! He sounds matured and knowledgeable!

  646. Josh says:


    No I am in the sleepy MidWest. I did live in Manhattan and surrounding areas for nearly 20 years though.

  647. Kms2014 says:

    Jaime, well..there is just one, for now. 😉

  648. Josh says:

    Sorry JamieSB, I’d thought that everyone knew FRCRG.

    It stands for Fucking Retard Clueless Relationship Guru. 😉

  649. K-Lady says:

    I enjoy reading these, even if I already know, it’s always good to reflect back!

  650. JamieSB says:

    @ Josh
    Hallo : ) can’t read your abbreviation : ) sorry not very good at all. Are you in NYC? That would be my dream city to visit. Got invited to go there before by a random multi millionaire I shared a cab with here in Melb. But heard so many good things about it!! Plus it’s summer there?
    It’s winter here sadly in down under : (
    @ Kms
    Thank you again for your advice and concerns. It’s kindly appreciated : ) I’m aware there are heaps flakes and scammers which I encountered! For me it’s all part of the experience. Nothing bitter. Worst case I shrug off and move on.
    Glad your arrangements are ok ; ))

  651. Josh says:

    Most of the blog SBs are fucking hot so no wonder these blog gamers pretending to be SDs use the sugar lingo to get into their panties because they know a lot more about them than the random SBs on SA.

  652. flyR says:

    @sunshineSD “There is a bit of gender asymmetry when it comes to legal age of consent. Prosecutor’s taking on cases where female teachers having affair with teen boys are often jeered with “where was my teacher?” LOL. I remember when I was 13-16, trying to seduce the 21 yo fresh out of college teacher was a major competitive sport among the high achieving boys. LOL.””

    It’s ironic that the liberal educational and press establishments which are so obsessed with manufacturing self esteem out vapors rather than achievement, gets its collective panties in a wad over female teachers providing the greatest male adolescent self esteem builder in the universe and at no cost to the district. The bombshell teacher having sex with the high school student gets front page while the male molesting little boys gets the back page.

    One extreme example – had the Santa Barbara stabber/shooter been the beneficiary of educational mercy sex, 7 people might still be living. There was a time when many fathers made sure their son did not pass 16 without an introduction to sex.

  653. Kms2014 says:

    @Jaime, It is going good, I guess…has been better but not too bad (: I wasn’t trying to say that it wasn’t ideal for you, but didn’t know if you were new. Some men, on SA, try to pull scams of pretending to be a SD, when they really just want a dating scenario with a girl they could never get, in real life…Of course, there are all kinds of different shades of arrangements. I like very green ones, hehe 😉

  654. Josh says:


    After blessing KatPaw, now this FRCRG is going to bless you with your situation too. 😉

  655. JamieSB says:

    Sounds exciting!!! Fingers crossed!!!
    Thank you for your advice : ) coffee or tea at my place seems to be the next step definitely!!!

  656. SunshineSD says:

    Perhaps he is just being a gentleman. Did you drop hints that you are ready to step up to the next level? Like inviting him to have coffee at your place after one of so many dinners? If you are indeed dealing with a big fish, genuine dating probably will benefit you more than a preset number arrangement.

  657. Josh says:



  658. KatPaw says:


    He’s trying to get a flight out here tonight if not tomorrow am.. So fingers crossed it works out!! Very excited to meet face to face!

  659. Josh says:

    Hmmm, I DNGTM that we HMOT the YMIS realm?

  660. JamieSB says:

    @ Katpaw
    Hello right back!!
    How is your Pot SD going? Is he making it to your area?
    : )

  661. SunshineSD says:

    LOL, the baby will be their tormentor when you cut them off. Wait, if you have been bottom feeding every month before the girl has to pay rent, why would she have any expectation of you having the wattage to bankroll her, her bf and her baby? Just tell her the truth about your situation, and she will try blackmailing someone worth blackmailing instead.

  662. JamieSB says:

    *don’t need to
    Sorry autocorrect : /

  663. KatPaw says:

    Gooooood morrrrrning sugarrrrr!
    Hope everyone is good this lovely Saturday!

    What’s everyone’s sugar plans for the weekend?

  664. JamieSB says:

    Allowance comes in all forms and colors. No I don’t mind ‘dating’ him in which case then : )
    I don’t catch the small fish cuz I find need to, just the shark ; ) but thank you for your concerns ; )
    How are your sugaring going miss Kms?

  665. Kms2014 says:

    I thought, MO, was a very popular acronym? I use it a lot…I think, Josh, must be teasing with you, SunshineSD, in order to get you all worked up and searching Wikipedia again 😉

    Jaime, if he is just dating you, then that isn’t a SD…I mean, it is not my affair or business, and do not know all the details…but even when I wasn’t having intimacy with a SD, and we were just doing dinners, he was still giving me an allowance….Of course, if this is okay with you, then please disregard. I just meant some men on this site, in the past, who were not real SD and they were just trying to ‘date’ me.

  666. JamieSB says:

    Hallo : )
    Is it too early for an argument? ( even with Josh?) haha

  667. SunshineSD says:

    You are doing fine all by yourself showing us what a joke you are. Did your sister or cousin tell mama on you?

  668. Josh says:


    “What did she do? Threatening to tell your mom?”

    Nope. Not yet. She threatened me that she will go have a baby with an Xbox playing drug addict.

    I was gshook up because now I will have to support her, her Xbox player and the baby. 😉

  669. Josh says:

    Awww, don’t you miss your psychopath blog mama to provide talking points against me? 😉

  670. SunshineSD says:

    MO = Modus Operandi; operating mode, methodology. It’s the very first entry when you Google “MO”; the only other entry (#2) is for the state of Missouri.

    IIRC = if I remember correctly.
    If you Google it, entries #2 through #5 all